Engine bolt threads

[Andrew Clayton]

Hi all, Can someone enlighten me about the correct threads for the bolt holes in XPAG/XPEG engines. I always thought they were standard metric with Whitworth heads but now I'm not so sure - someone I met described them as "mad metric" which he said is a little different to standard metric - I always thought this referred to the combination of metric with Whitworth. So what is correct?? I've tried to look on The Sacred Octagon CD but I can't get the bloody thing to work. I also looked at the technology section of T-ABC and this seems to confirm the threads are metric. Cheers, Andrew Clayton Melbourne, Australia TC 4054 ---------- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - Release Date: 10/06/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[TMcNam4510@aol.com]

Hey Andrew, I'm not sure about the "mad metric" thing but I am sure that most of the threads on the XPAG and bell housing are 8.1 mm. I am currently in the throes of rebuilding TC 2850 and I am not going the extra mile for the whitworth headed 8.1 mm. There are also a few 6.1mm threads. There is a list in this list if you look in the special files. Good Luck, Tom, TC2850, disassembled [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[BobAlley747@aol.com]

Threads are metric the heads Whitworth. Bob TC6198 TC5894 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[ROSS TAYLOR]

G'day The threads are Metric fine ie 8mm dia by 1mm pitch ,the bolt heads are BSF, Metric standard bolts are 8mm by 1.25 mm pitch slightly courser than the metric fine threads and they are very close to 5/16 BSF. Ross in Tea Gardens

>Hi all, > >Can someone enlighten me about the correct threads for the bolt holes in >XPAG/XPEG engines. I always thought they were standard metric with >Whitworth heads but now I'm not so sure - someone I met described them as >"mad metric" which he said is a little different to standard metric - I >always thought this referred to the combination of metric with Whitworth. >So what is correct?? > >I've tried to look on The Sacred Octagon CD but I can't get the bloody >thing to work. I also looked at the technology section of T-ABC and this >seems to confirm the threads are metric. > >Cheers, > >Andrew Clayton >Melbourne, Australia >TC 4054 > ---------- > >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - Release Date: 10/06/2005 > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

[Andrew Clayton]

Many thanks to all who replied to my question about metric threads. My understanding was that mad metric referred to the combination of metric threads with whitworth heads and a few people confirmed this. Other than that, we have to be careful to specify fine metric threads instead of standard metric but I (and others) don't think this is too much of a problem. Thanks again, Andrew Clayton Melbourne, Australia TC 4054 ---------- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - Release Date: 10/06/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[boltonmg@comcast.net]

Hi Andrew, I see others have given you the correct reply, which you knew already, but I was waiting for some of the experts to say that there is actually a difference between metric that Lord Nuffield used and today's modern metric. But I can't remember the precise difference, thinking that it is the specifications of the root of the threads. The threads are essentially interchangeable and a different thread root form should only effect stress properties. I found a web site http://euler9.tripod.com/bolt-database/22.html which states that today's ISO metric was derived from the French standard. Nuffield "went metric" because he bought thread cutting machinery from a bankrupt Hotchkiss factory, but didn't want to get mechanics to change their tools, so manufactured the bolts and nuts with Whitworth head sizes. I'm not suggesting everyone read the technical specifications in the web page, but do try to look at paragraph "i". The author has got America's decline in world commerce summed up. Cheers, Peter Ross Bolton, Massachusetts TC 8892 -------------- Original message --------------

> Hi all, > > Can someone enlighten me about the correct threads for the bolt holes in > XPAG/XPEG engines. I always thought they were standard metric with Whitworth > heads but now I'm not so sure - someone I met described them as "mad metric" > which he said is a little different to standard metric - I always thought this > referred to the combination of metric with Whitworth. So what is correct?? > > I've tried to look on The Sacred Octagon CD but I can't get the bloody thing to > work. I also looked at the technology section of T-ABC and this seems to confirm > the threads are metric. > > Cheers, > > Andrew Clayton > Melbourne, Australia > TC 4054 > ---------- > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - Release Date: 10/06/2005 > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[ian thomson]

Hi Andrew. The mad metrics have a different pitch (1mm)to the more commonly found items as well as BSF/W heads. As for the SO CD many people have problems with the front end. Just open up the "files" folder (i think it's called that - I haven't woken up properly yet this morning but I'm sure you will find it if I am wrong) and you will find each individual issue there as a standard acrobat file. Use an earlier version of acrobat then Seven though. You will lose the search function this way but all the info is there. Regards Ian Thomson --- Andrew Clayton andyc@alphalink.com.au> wrote:

> Hi all, > > Can someone enlighten me about the correct threads > for the bolt holes in XPAG/XPEG engines. I always > thought they were standard metric with Whitworth > heads but now I'm not so sure - someone I met > described them as "mad metric" which he said is a > little different to standard metric - I always > thought this referred to the combination of metric > with Whitworth. So what is correct?? > > I've tried to look on The Sacred Octagon CD but I > can't get the bloody thing to work. I also looked at > the technology section of T-ABC and this seems to > confirm the threads are metric. > > Cheers, > > Andrew Clayton > Melbourne, Australia > TC 4054 > ---------- > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - Release > Date: 10/06/2005 > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > mg-tabc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > >

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[ian thomson]

I'm glad you said that last bit Peter as I can imagine the howls of damaged pride if a non American (discounting the countries of south and central America + Canada) had said that. Ian Thomson. ---------- --- boltonmg@comcast.net wrote:

> Hi Andrew, > > I see others have given you the correct reply, which > you knew already, but I was waiting for some of the > experts to say that there is actually a difference > between metric that Lord Nuffield used and today's > modern metric. But I can't remember the precise > difference, thinking that it is the specifications > of the root of the threads. The threads are > essentially interchangeable and a different thread > root form should only effect stress properties. > > I found a web site > http://euler9.tripod.com/bolt-database/22.html which > states that today's ISO metric was derived from the > French standard. Nuffield "went metric" because he > bought thread cutting machinery from a bankrupt > Hotchkiss factory, but didn't want to get mechanics > to change their tools, so manufactured the bolts and > nuts with Whitworth head sizes. > > I'm not suggesting everyone read the technical > specifications in the web page, but do try to look > at paragraph "i". The author has got America's > decline in world commerce summed up. > > Cheers, > Peter Ross > Bolton, Massachusetts > TC 8892 > > -------------- Original message -------------- > > > Hi all, > > > > Can someone enlighten me about the correct threads > for the bolt holes in > > XPAG/XPEG engines. I always thought they were > standard metric with Whitworth > > heads but now I'm not so sure - someone I met > described them as "mad metric" > > which he said is a little different to standard > metric - I always thought this > > referred to the combination of metric with > Whitworth. So what is correct?? > > > > I've tried to look on The Sacred Octagon CD but I > can't get the bloody thing to > > work. I also looked at the technology section of > T-ABC and this seems to confirm > > the threads are metric. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Andrew Clayton > > Melbourne, Australia > > TC 4054 > > ---------- > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - > Release Date: 10/06/2005 > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > mg-tabc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > >

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[Bob Grunau]

Hi Ian and Andrew, Just to clarify, metric bolts/threads found on the XPAG/XPEG engines are: 6 x 1.0 mm ( standard metric ) eg oil pump bolts 8 x 1.0 mm ( metric fine ) eg oil pan bolts 10 x 1.5 mm ( standard metric ) eg Head studs 12 x 1.5 mm ( metric fine ) eg Main bearing studs The "different pitch" of 1.0 mm only applies to the 8 mm size bolts in the engine/gearbox. Modern metric bolts can be found for all applications, however they use modern metric bolt heads, not BSF/W bolt heads so your expensive English wrenches don't fit. Bob Grunau Hi Andrew. The mad metrics have a different pitch (1mm)to the more commonly found items as well as BSF/W heads. As for the SO CD many people have problems with the front end. Just open up the "files" folder (i think it's called that - I haven't woken up properly yet this morning but I'm sure you will find it if I am wrong) and you will find each individual issue there as a standard acrobat file. Use an earlier version of acrobat then Seven though. You will lose the search function this way but all the info is there. Regards Ian Thomson

> Hi all, > > Can someone enlighten me about the correct threads > for the bolt holes in XPAG/XPEG engines. I always > thought they were standard metric with Whitworth > heads but now I'm not so sure - someone I met > described them as "mad metric" which he said is a > little different to standard metric - I always > thought this referred to the combination of metric > with Whitworth. So what is correct?? > > I've tried to look on The Sacred Octagon CD but I > can't get the bloody thing to work. I also looked at > the technology section of T-ABC and this seems to > confirm the threads are metric. > > Cheers, > > Andrew Clayton > Melbourne, Australia > TC 4054

[1939mgtb]

The author has got America's decline in world commerce summed up. "due to inefficient business practices, low educational level, slackerism, and inability to solve or understand even simple problems such as metric conversion." And that's why the US is home to the largest banking systems on the planet, has the vast majority of communications satellites and their development, and the most advanced medical research on the planet. And why American English (with a sprinkling of non-Americanisms)is the international language of aviation. Sorry Peter. Not all the problems in the world are our fault, and Japan is now kissing some serious booty with the monetary system. Back to Michael Moore's book for ya..... PS....the US "slackers" started and developed the internet we are now using to exchange ideas... We CHOOSE not to go metric. Remember the kilometer per hour highway signs? Best, Ray "Much can be achieved with a smile. However, much more can be achieved with a smile and a gun."

----- Original Message ----- From: "ian thomson" i.thomson@talk21.com> To: boltonmg@comcast.net>; "Andrew Clayton" andyc@alphalink.com.au>; mg-tabc@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 5:06 AM Subject: Re: [mg-tabc] Engine bolt threads > I'm glad you said that last bit Peter as I can imagine > the howls of damaged pride if a non American > (discounting the countries of south and central > America + Canada) had said that. > > Ian Thomson. > > ---------- > > --- boltonmg@comcast.net wrote: > >> Hi Andrew, >> >> I see others have given you the correct reply, which >> you knew already, but I was waiting for some of the >> experts to say that there is actually a difference >> between metric that Lord Nuffield used and today's >> modern metric. But I can't remember the precise >> difference, thinking that it is the specifications >> of the root of the threads. The threads are >> essentially interchangeable and a different thread >> root form should only effect stress properties. >> >> I found a web site >> http://euler9.tripod.com/bolt-database/22.html which >> states that today's ISO metric was derived from the >> French standard. Nuffield "went metric" because he >> bought thread cutting machinery from a bankrupt >> Hotchkiss factory, but didn't want to get mechanics >> to change their tools, so manufactured the bolts and >> nuts with Whitworth head sizes. >> >> I'm not suggesting everyone read the technical >> specifications in the web page, but do try to look >> at paragraph "i". The author has got America's >> decline in world commerce summed up. >> >> Cheers, >> Peter Ross >> Bolton, Massachusetts >> TC 8892 >> >> -------------- Original message -------------- >> >> > Hi all, >> > >> > Can someone enlighten me about the correct threads >> for the bolt holes in >> > XPAG/XPEG engines. I always thought they were >> standard metric with Whitworth >> > heads but now I'm not so sure - someone I met >> described them as "mad metric" >> > which he said is a little different to standard >> metric - I always thought this >> > referred to the combination of metric with >> Whitworth. So what is correct?? >> > >> > I've tried to look on The Sacred Octagon CD but I >> can't get the bloody thing to >> > work. I also looked at the technology section of >> T-ABC and this seems to confirm >> > the threads are metric. >> > >> > Cheers, >> > >> > Andrew Clayton >> > Melbourne, Australia >> > TC 4054 >> > ---------- >> > >> > No virus found in this outgoing message. >> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - >> Release Date: 10/06/2005 >> > >> > >> > [Non-text portions of this message have been >> removed] >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been >> removed] >> >> >> >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> mg-tabc-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with > voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >