TC clutch won't release

[candahill@worldnet.att.net]

After everything else that went on yesterday, I decided to take my TC for a drive in the evening. The weather was perfect. Just needed to add some air to the leaky tire. Pulled out of the garage and started down the road. Everything was going fine until I got to the first stop sign a few blocks from my house. I pushed in on the clutch pedal and tried to shift in to first. Grind, Grind, Grind. It wouldn't go in to gear. The clutch wasn't releasing. As a Porsche 914 owner, I am quite familiar with the drill on limping home with a clutch that won't release. Also glad I put in that Optima battery. When I got home, a visual inspection didn't reveal any obvious external problems. I knew that the chain was/is a little too long and there is no more adjustment available. It does appear to be a little loose, but not that loose. Decided yesterday was not the time to mess with it and moved on to other things. Now my questions are: 1.How long should the chain be? I'm hoping I can shorten it a link or two and fix the problem. 2.Can I really see anything thru the "inspection cover" on top of the bell housing? 3.There is no squealling, rattling, clunking or other signs that its the throwout bearing. Any ideas or suggestions welcome. Regards, Charles Hill

[oldmgdoc@aol.com]

Charles, The TC has two clutch adjustments. One is the chain which had 8 links when new. The other adjustment is a stop adjustment. On the top of the clutch arm there is a bolt with a lock nut. This has to be adjusted so the clutch will release but will not go over center. The original TO bearing pad on the pressure plate was about 1/8" thicker than the replacement pressure plates. You can remove a link from the chain to make up for this difference. The inspection hole will not do you any good. If these adjustments do not solve your problem, you will have to examine the clutch assy. Mike Goodman

[Bill Traill]

Charles, The problem with your clutch may be debris lodged between the flywheel and clutch disk. The debris would probably be from a disintegrated spring as was in my case. I was at a stop light and anticipating the change to green, slipped into first and began to bring up the RPM. All of a sudden the TC lurched out into the intersection. Luckily the light had just changed. Cause: part of a disintegrated spring from the clutch disk got between the surfaces. Two weeks before this incident one of the fingers on the pressure plate let go. I ordered a new pressure plate from Moss and the sales rep suggested also a new clutch disk. Being a cash strapped college student I declined. Bill Traill San Jose, California DCO: TC#5221 Everything was going fine until I got to the

> first stop sign a few blocks from my house. I pushed in > on the clutch pedal and tried to shift in to first. > Grind, Grind, Grind. It wouldn't go in to gear. T

[Charles Hill]

I'm afraid that Mike Goodman and Bill Traill have confirmed my suspicions that there is something seriously wrong with my clutch. The linkage is just as Mike described it. The stop bolt is adjusted in as far as it will go and bottoms out when the clutch pedal is depressed. The clutch still does not release. This leads me to believe that Bill's diagnosis that something has lodged between the driving and driven parts, jamming up the mechanism. I'm afraid everything is going to have to come apart to check. So much for enjoying the fall MG driving weather. Another semi-related question. I checked the linkage on my other TC - a perpetual restoration project - and there are several differences in the clutch linkage: 1. on the running car (TC7387), the chain has 8 links as stated by Mike and is about 5 1/2" long - not counting the fittings on each end. On the other car (TC0857), the chain only has 6 links and is about 4 1/4" long. On 7387, the previous owner had stuck a bolt between 2 links to be able to adjust the clutch. The nut on the adjustment bolt on the chain is bottomed out and the stop bolt barely hits the bolt head on the bell housing. On 0857, the adjustment seems to be near the middle of the adjustment screw. (Can't be 100% sure until the car is finally on the road.) Any idea as to which (if either) of these chains are correct? 2. Also noticed that the arms on the bellhousing are different. The arm on 7387 has a definite S curve between the pivot and where the chain attaches. 0857's arm is straight. Is this another one of those multitude of minor differences between early and late TCs? Are the arms functionally the same? I guess I'll have to make some measurements and determine if the angular relationship between the stop bolt, pivot and chain attachment are the same on both. Any ideas/opinions here? I have no idea at to what is original and what isn't on either one of these cars. Regards, Charles Hill

[Charles Hill]

I've had several replies off list to my question about the TC clutch linkage. From the small sample so far, it seems that there are 2 different clutch linkages on the TC. Evidently, early TCs have a 6 link 4 1/4" chain and a straight arm attached to the bellhousing and later TCs have an 8 link 5 1/2" chain and an S shaped arm on the bellhousing. I have no idea of when the change was made and could care less. Just thought that everyone should know about the differences if you ever have to work on your clutch linkage. Could be quite a "gotcha" if you end up with mismatched parts. But then I also have an almost uncontrollable temptation to investigate this discovery in detail just to irritate Badger. Regards, Charles Hill

[Robert Grunau]

Please remember that there are a number of different throw out bearings that look the same but have different offsets and these will affect clutch operation. You want a T/O bearing that measures 13/16" from the carbon face to the center of the pivit fork pin. Also make sure the clutch lever starts forward of vertical and then goes through vertical as it disengages the clutch. Bob. I've had several replies off list to my question about the TC clutch linkage. From the small sample so far, it seems that there are 2 different clutch linkages on the TC. Evidently, early TCs have a 6 link 4 1/4" chain and a straight arm attached to the bellhousing and later TCs have an 8 link 5 1/2" chain and an S shaped arm on the bellhousing. I have no idea of when the change was made and could care less. Just thought that everyone should know about the differences if you ever have to work on your clutch linkage. Could be quite a "gotcha" if you end up with mismatched parts. But then I also have an almost uncontrollable temptation to investigate this discovery in detail just to irritate Badger. Regards, Charles Hill Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

[candahill@worldnet.att.net]

I got my TC apart last night to check out my clutch problem. The problem is that one of the release fingers on the pressure plate broke. Everything else looks fine. The flywheel isn't worn at all. I am, of course, going to replace all the normal components. The most convenient source for parts is MOSS USA. Has anyone had any experience with their clutch parts recently? I remember hearing something about replacing a TC clutch with a Sunbeam Alpine clutch. Anyone know anything about this change and reason for doing so? Regards, Charles Hill

[Robert Grunau]

I got my TC apart last night to check out my clutch problem. The problem is that one of the release fingers on the pressure plate broke. Everything else looks fine. The flywheel isn't worn at all. I am, of course, going to replace all the normal components. You could just replace the one finger from a used clutch. The most convenient source for parts is MOSS USA. Has anyone had any experience with their clutch parts recently? I remember hearing something about replacing a TC clutch with a Sunbeam Alpine clutch. Anyone know anything about this change and reason for doing so? The 7 1/2" Alpine clutch is a diaphram clutch and has the advantage of no realease fingers or springs to go wrong. Also has much more holding power than the spring clutch. Hence also a heavier clutch pedal. Use stock TC driven plate. The Alpine clutch bolts right on to TC flywheel but you need two more dowel pin holes ( the Alpine has 3 ) and a different, ie longer or more offset , throwout bearing. I like it in my race TC and will use one in the road TC. I would also lighten the TC flywheel and balance the whole assembly. The stock TC "red spring" original clutch is marginal at best for holding power. MG used to supply a heavier version "blue spring" clutch and I would certainly recommend this over the original. I have no idea what is currently supplied by the MG suppliers. Bob

[David Lodge]

Charles, TC clutch? Fingers?! Regards, David Lodge candahill@worldnet.att.net wrote:

> I got my TC apart last night to check out my clutch > problem. The problem is that one of the release fingers > on the pressure plate broke. Everything else looks > fine. The flywheel isn't worn at all. I am, of course, > going to replace all the normal components. The most > convenient source for parts is MOSS USA. Has anyone had > any experience with their clutch parts recently? I > remember hearing something about replacing a TC clutch > with a Sunbeam Alpine clutch. Anyone know anything > about this change and reason for doing so? > > Regards, > Charles Hill > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

[joecurto@aol.com]

Yeah Mrs. Pauls makes them from COD Fish. Joe