alternative to k&n air filter oil

[Jonathan Kalmes]

Hey guys, I have a problem that I've been fighting with for a few months now and I'm at my wits end. I have an '08 KLR that's afraid of water. ANY water! When it's wet, the bike dies whenever I stop. Most of the time I can start it again... Once. Doesn't make much difference as it will immediately die at the next stop light and I won't be able to start it again. I carry around a 3mm allen wrench so I can dump the carb bowl, as that's the only way to get it going again. Of course, that's assuming that it's no longer wet out. I've done just about everything I can think of and I'm now almost ready to roll it off a cliff just to be rid of it. I drained the gas tank completely, then set a fan pointing into it for two days to make sure it was absolutely dry. I did the T-Mod... the new line runs down where the other two lines exit by the footpeg. The old breather line is under the seat right where Kawasaki put it on the 08-09s. I've changed to a K&N air filter (I was running out of possibilities and was desperate). The has never been any water in the airbox that I've been able to detect. WTF?!? To give you an idea of how ridiculous this now is... I rode out to a friend's house today - 60 miles. I rode home. Made it 55 miles. Then I hit wet roads. It wasn't raining, but there was just enough water left on the road from a previous shower that the car in front of me was spraying up a little water. I could barely see it. I didn't even have to wipe my face shield. I didn't drive through any puddles. I stopped at the next stop light with about 2 miles to get home. The bike died. I started it (barely) and didn't stop again until I got home. I should note that this is about the 8th stop light I hit on this stretch of road... the others were dry. I stopped in the garage and the bike died again. It won't start now, and probably won't until I drain the bowl tomorrow. I checked the bottom breather tube coming off the T-Mod and I could find no signs of water in it (it's clear tubing). I didn't check the top one because I have to remove 6 bolts to get the seat off and I'm seriously tired. I'd bet that there's no sign of water. When the bike dies, I still have all electrical functionality... brake light, head lights, dash lights, horn, starter, etc. It acts like it just ran out of fuel (tank is about half full right now). I'm desperate. What else can I do for this? The bike is essentially useless, as I'm almost guaranteed to find rain again some day and I don't feel like being stranded until the roads dry out. My wife is also seriously getting tired of never knowing when I'll make it home. --Jonathan Kalmes Follow our adventures at http://wegofar.com Twitter - http://twitter.com/smthng Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/smthng FriendFeed - http://friendfeed.com/smthng "Shake well... some settling is natural."

[Lou]

At 01:20 AM 9/13/2009, Jonathan Kalmes wrote:

> > > >When the bike dies, I still have all electrical functionality... brake >light, head lights, dash lights, horn, starter, etc. It acts like it >just ran out of fuel (tank is about half full right now). > >I'm desperate. What else can I do for this?

Hmmm ... my '08 developed a somewhat similar issue -- sudden unpredictable loss of engine -- and it turned out to be the *&^%$# wiring harness which had chafed just enough (at the point where the harness emerged into view at the front end of the fuel tank) so that something, perhaps the kill switch?, was grounding out. I finally realized what it was when I noticed that the bike would never die in a corner but always at moments when handlebars were nearly straight ... anyhow, Kawasaki recalled and replaced the harness. Haven't had a "fuel problem" since that happy day. So, did you do the wiring-harness recall yet? --And even if you already did, I suggest that the symptoms you're seeing could still be some electrical element shorting out when it sees moisture. There's the kickstand interlock for example... Best wishes, Lou Green '08 Maine

[Jeff Saline]

On Sun, 13 Sep 2009 01:20:09 -0400 Jonathan Kalmes writes:

> Hey guys, > > I have a problem that I've been fighting with for a few months now > and > I'm at my wits end. I have an '08 KLR that's afraid of water. ANY > water! When it's wet, the bike dies whenever I stop. Most of the > time I can start it again... Once.

BIG SNIP <><><><><><><><><><> <><><><><><><><><><> Jonathan, I'm with Lou that this sounds like it's electrical and not a fuel issue. I used to have a VW bug (back in the mid 70s) that I called "Start". That was because most of the time it wouldn't when it was wet. It didn't have to get wet but just the moisture in the air was enough to keep it from starting. Turned out to be the ignition system was grounding out from high humidity. The fix was spraying it with hair spray to protect the distributor cap, rotor, wires and coil wiring. I bet you had the recall taken care of already but if you didn't I'd suggest that is a good place to start looking. After that I'd be pulling the tank and checking out the wires from the kill switch to the main wire harness for a loose connection or exposed wire. I'd also take a good look at the wiring for the ignition system and for a cracked coil or CDI. I remember hearing the ignition on the new models is different from the pre 08s so can't suggest exactly where to look. I'm gonna guess it stops just like you turned the key off and it doesn't come to a sputtering, coughing stop like running out of fuel. Might be there is just enough air movement at speed to keep moisture off the critical area but when stopped the moisture collects and shorts out the ignition system. Hope you can locate your bike's problem. Best, Jeff Saline ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT . ____________________________________________________________ Top-Rated Handymen Find 5-star rated local handymen & get free estimates today! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=meTc-g7sIPT7TEFhnNnzDAAAJ1DWfJIDP-R0_NC3mMpGFS0kAAQAAAAFAAAAAEbcHD0AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAEhhRAAAAAA==

[tgornall]

Sound electrical to me. I had a similar issue on a old airhead BMW, turned out to be a hairline crack in the coil. Though you issue is a little different, mine would not start until things dried out. It doesnt sound like fuel, not enough moisture. Tim

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Kalmes wrote: > > Hey guys, > > I have a problem that I've been fighting with for a few months now and > I'm at my wits end. I have an '08 KLR that's afraid of water. ANY > water! When it's wet, the bike dies whenever I stop. Most of the > time I can start it again... Once. Doesn't make much difference as it > will immediately die at the next stop light and I won't be able to > start it again. I carry around a 3mm allen wrench so I can dump the > carb bowl, as that's the only way to get it going again. Of course, > that's assuming that it's no longer wet out. I've done just about > everything I can think of and I'm now almost ready to roll it off a > cliff just to be rid of it. > > I drained the gas tank completely, then set a fan pointing into it for > two days to make sure it was absolutely dry. > > I did the T-Mod... the new line runs down where the other two lines > exit by the footpeg. The old breather line is under the seat right > where Kawasaki put it on the 08-09s. I've changed to a K&N air filter > (I was running out of possibilities and was desperate). The has never > been any water in the airbox that I've been able to detect. WTF?!? > > To give you an idea of how ridiculous this now is... I rode out to a > friend's house today - 60 miles. I rode home. Made it 55 miles. > Then I hit wet roads. It wasn't raining, but there was just enough > water left on the road from a previous shower that the car in front of > me was spraying up a little water. I could barely see it. I didn't > even have to wipe my face shield. I didn't drive through any puddles. > I stopped at the next stop light with about 2 miles to get home. The > bike died. I started it (barely) and didn't stop again until I got > home. I should note that this is about the 8th stop light I hit on > this stretch of road... the others were dry. I stopped in the garage > and the bike died again. It won't start now, and probably won't until > I drain the bowl tomorrow. > > I checked the bottom breather tube coming off the T-Mod and I could > find no signs of water in it (it's clear tubing). I didn't check the > top one because I have to remove 6 bolts to get the seat off and I'm > seriously tired. I'd bet that there's no sign of water. > > When the bike dies, I still have all electrical functionality... brake > light, head lights, dash lights, horn, starter, etc. It acts like it > just ran out of fuel (tank is about half full right now). > > I'm desperate. What else can I do for this? The bike is essentially > useless, as I'm almost guaranteed to find rain again some day and I > don't feel like being stranded until the roads dry out. My wife is > also seriously getting tired of never knowing when I'll make it home. > > --Jonathan Kalmes > Follow our adventures at http://wegofar.com > Twitter - http://twitter.com/smthng > Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/smthng > FriendFeed - http://friendfeed.com/smthng > "Shake well... some settling is natural." >

[twrecks2]

Jonathan Tim is probably on the money here. I rented a ring ding in the D.R. a few years ago which did the same thing. I fixed it with a coconut. The fender was too short which allowed water- any water- to wet the plug. The coconut made a good fender extension. Get a spray bottle and fill it with water. Warm up the KLR and spray the plug first. If she keeps running spray up the wire to the coil until it quits. Do the job in the dark and you may see where the coil is leaking. I also have a BMW with this issue, a bit silicone smeared into the crack is all it takes to get things back in order. If you find she quits with water at the plug, replace the plug and don't forget the grease in the cap! Hope this gets you back to burning gas! Shane

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "tgornall" wrote: > > Sound electrical to me. I had a similar issue on a old airhead BMW, turned out to be a hairline crack in the coil. Though you issue is a little different, mine would not start until things dried out. It doesnt sound like fuel, not enough moisture. > Tim > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan Kalmes wrote: > > > > Hey guys, > > > > I have a problem that I've been fighting with for a few months now and > > I'm at my wits end. I have an '08 KLR that's afraid of water. ANY > > water! When it's wet, the bike dies whenever I stop. Most of the > > time I can start it again... Once. Doesn't make much difference as it > > will immediately die at the next stop light and I won't be able to > > start it again. I carry around a 3mm allen wrench so I can dump the > > carb bowl, as that's the only way to get it going again. Of course, > > that's assuming that it's no longer wet out. I've done just about > > everything I can think of and I'm now almost ready to roll it off a > > cliff just to be rid of it. > > > > I drained the gas tank completely, then set a fan pointing into it for > > two days to make sure it was absolutely dry. > > > > I did the T-Mod... the new line runs down where the other two lines > > exit by the footpeg. The old breather line is under the seat right > > where Kawasaki put it on the 08-09s. I've changed to a K&N air filter > > (I was running out of possibilities and was desperate). The has never > > been any water in the airbox that I've been able to detect. WTF?!? > > > > To give you an idea of how ridiculous this now is... I rode out to a > > friend's house today - 60 miles. I rode home. Made it 55 miles. > > Then I hit wet roads. It wasn't raining, but there was just enough > > water left on the road from a previous shower that the car in front of > > me was spraying up a little water. I could barely see it. I didn't > > even have to wipe my face shield. I didn't drive through any puddles. > > I stopped at the next stop light with about 2 miles to get home. The > > bike died. I started it (barely) and didn't stop again until I got > > home. I should note that this is about the 8th stop light I hit on > > this stretch of road... the others were dry. I stopped in the garage > > and the bike died again. It won't start now, and probably won't until > > I drain the bowl tomorrow. > > > > I checked the bottom breather tube coming off the T-Mod and I could > > find no signs of water in it (it's clear tubing). I didn't check the > > top one because I have to remove 6 bolts to get the seat off and I'm > > seriously tired. I'd bet that there's no sign of water. > > > > When the bike dies, I still have all electrical functionality... brake > > light, head lights, dash lights, horn, starter, etc. It acts like it > > just ran out of fuel (tank is about half full right now). > > > > I'm desperate. What else can I do for this? The bike is essentially > > useless, as I'm almost guaranteed to find rain again some day and I > > don't feel like being stranded until the roads dry out. My wife is > > also seriously getting tired of never knowing when I'll make it home. > > > > --Jonathan Kalmes > > Follow our adventures at http://wegofar.com > > Twitter - http://twitter.com/smthng > > Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/smthng > > FriendFeed - http://friendfeed.com/smthng > > "Shake well... some settling is natural." > > >

[matteeanne@yahoo.com]

with 35,000 on my 08' I would wager it is in fact the wiring harness under the tank. It was a recall/free fix at the dealer. Mine left me stranded 7 times, yes, 7 times before I finally tracked it down (before the recall). On a lighter note I am 22,000 miles trouble free now. Anyone got a spare rear brake disk I can buy? Sean Brown Looking for the perfect gift for the wife/Mom/or "the person who has everything?" www.brownsbirdestates.com To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 1:10:47 PM Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: KLR afraid of water Jonathan Tim is probably on the money here. I rented a ring ding in the D.R. a few years ago which did the same thing. I fixed it with a coconut. The fender was too short which allowed water- any water- to wet the plug. The coconut made a good fender extension. Get a spray bottle and fill it with water. Warm up the KLR and spray the plug first. If she keeps running spray up the wire to the coil until it quits. Do the job in the dark and you may see where the coil is leaking. I also have a BMW with this issue, a bit silicone smeared into the crack is all it takes to get things back in order. If you find she quits with water at the plug, replace the plug and don't forget the grease in the cap! Hope this gets you back to burning gas! Shane

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogro ups.com, "tgornall" wrote: > > Sound electrical to me. I had a similar issue on a old airhead BMW, turned out to be a hairline crack in the coil. Though you issue is a little different, mine would not start until things dried out. It doesnt sound like fuel, not enough moisture. > Tim > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogro ups.com, Jonathan Kalmes wrote: > > > > Hey guys, > > > > I have a problem that I've been fighting with for a few months now and > > I'm at my wits end. I have an '08 KLR that's afraid of water. ANY > > water! When it's wet, the bike dies whenever I stop. Most of the > > time I can start it again... Once. Doesn't make much difference as it > > will immediately die at the next stop light and I won't be able to > > start it again. I carry around a 3mm allen wrench so I can dump the > > carb bowl, as that's the only way to get it going again. Of course, > > that's assuming that it's no longer wet out. I've done just about > > everything I can think of and I'm now almost ready to roll it off a > > cliff just to be rid of it. > > > > I drained the gas tank completely, then set a fan pointing into it for > > two days to make sure it was absolutely dry. > > > > I did the T-Mod... the new line runs down where the other two lines > > exit by the footpeg. The old breather line is under the seat right > > where Kawasaki put it on the 08-09s. I've changed to a K&N air filter > > (I was running out of possibilities and was desperate). The has never > > been any water in the airbox that I've been able to detect. WTF?!? > > > > To give you an idea of how ridiculous this now is... I rode out to a > > friend's house today - 60 miles. I rode home. Made it 55 miles. > > Then I hit wet roads. It wasn't raining, but there was just enough > > water left on the road from a previous shower that the car in front of > > me was spraying up a little water. I could barely see it. I didn't > > even have to wipe my face shield. I didn't drive through any puddles. > > I stopped at the next stop light with about 2 miles to get home. The > > bike died. I started it (barely) and didn't stop again until I got > > home. I should note that this is about the 8th stop light I hit on > > this stretch of road... the others were dry. I stopped in the garage > > and the bike died again. It won't start now, and probably won't until > > I drain the bowl tomorrow. > > > > I checked the bottom breather tube coming off the T-Mod and I could > > find no signs of water in it (it's clear tubing). I didn't check the > > top one because I have to remove 6 bolts to get the seat off and I'm > > seriously tired. I'd bet that there's no sign of water. > > > > When the bike dies, I still have all electrical functionality. .. brake > > light, head lights, dash lights, horn, starter, etc. It acts like it > > just ran out of fuel (tank is about half full right now). > > > > I'm desperate. What else can I do for this? The bike is essentially > > useless, as I'm almost guaranteed to find rain again some day and I > > don't feel like being stranded until the roads dry out. My wife is > > also seriously getting tired of never knowing when I'll make it home. > > > > --Jonathan Kalmes > > Follow our adventures at http://wegofar. com > > Twitter - http://twitter. com/smthng > > Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/smthng > > FriendFeed - http://friendfeed. com/smthng > > "Shake well... some settling is natural." > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Skypilot]

Pull the gas tank and look close and hard near the front edge of the tank. sounds like you are shorting out. It may not be the tank edge but under the wire by the frame. Make it humid enough and it makes good contact. Also have the dealer check you bike for recalls or service bulletins. There was one for the wire harness, and it matters!!!! I'm desperate. What else can I do for this? The bike is essentially useless, as I'm almost guaranteed to find rain again some day and I don't feel like being stranded until the roads dry out. My wife is also seriously getting tired of never knowing when I'll make it home. --Jonathan Kalmes [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[smthng2002]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Lou wrote:

> So, did you do the > wiring-harness recall yet?

I'm only quoting Lou, but I appreciate ALL the replies. General concensus seems to be that something is grounding or shorting out somewhere on the main harness. Probably so... It was dry today and the K fired right up so I figured I'd just go ahead and take it up to the dealer and dump it on them so they could do the recall on the harness. I hadn't done earlier it because I've been under the tank several times and checked the harness and there's never been any sign of an issue. Well, a couple miles from home, the K died again. I waggled the bars and it fired up. I made it another block and it conked again. This time it wouldn't fire, it just kept turning over when I tried to start it. I kept the starter going while I reached down and tugged on the wires coming out of the tank (throttle side) and it fired up. I messed with it some more and it died again. So, it does look like the harness. Of course, now it was being temperamental and I couldn't get it to run for more than a block or two. I called a friend to bring some tools, pulled the tank off and started disecting the harness. There was a little chafing on the harness below the voltage regulator, but only through the electrical tape wrapping, no damage to the wires. I pulled out all the other harness parts from under the frame and checked them all (and the connector contacts) and I can't find anything wrong with any of them. I put it all back together and buttoned everything up and she got me back home with no troubles. I'll trailer her out to the dealer and get the harness recall done (exhaust recall too, even though they already replaced the can the last time it fell off... before the recall). After that, I'll turn a sprinkler on her, and see how she does. I much appreciate all the assistance... I wouldn't have tackled the harness on the side of the road today without all of your advice... I'll also now quit screwing around with the fuel and air systems. Thanks again! --Jonathan

[Richard Decker]

FYI... get the notoil cleaner as well... That stuff is murder to get off otherwise...

On Sun, Sep 13, 2009 at 7:37 PM, Skypilot wrote: > > > You need to wring the oil out real well. I have an OEM and a UNI filter. If > I don t wring them out well enough when I oil them I find oil on the floor > the next morning. Freaked me out the first time but I couldn't find it. > Second time I used the K&N oil which is as red as Marvel Mystery oil. Next > morning I had a big red spot, then I knew what had happened the last time. > > Now I have a #10 tomato can, big restaurant sized tin can about 8 inches > across and 10 deep. I put a piece of gutter screen in the bottom so > anything > in it sits 1/2" off the bottom. Whenever I clean and oil filters, I do > three > at the same time, I toss them in there over night to let any oil I didn t > squeeze out drain. I used K&N last time to use it up. I had been planning > to > use 10/40 but may try the No Toil. I live near a Kawasaki shop so I can pop > in and buy the Kawi brand. I don t care about the price as much as do the > time it takes to do it so the No Toil sounds like a good choice. Still I at > least know 10/40 works fine for my 80% street > > From: Jokerloco9@... [mailto:Jokerloco9@...] > > Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 2:48 PM > To: skypilot@... ; > DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: alternative to K&N air filter oil > > I am as cheap as the next guy, but is there a possibility that the K&N oil > doesn't have all of the additives that are put in motor oil, and could > those > additives harm the pleated filter media in the air filter? > > Just curious. > > Jeff A20 > > In a message dated 9/12/2009 10:31:16 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > skypilot@... writes: > > 10/40, A few drops left over after pouring it in the engine > > alternative to K&N air filter oil > Posted by: "bali_blu" bali_blu@... bali_blu > > Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:37 pm (PDT) > > It seems pretty obvious, but just to be sure, what are all the other > (thrifty) KLRistas using to oil their air filters? > > Roger > > > -- - Rich Decker Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]