sad to say

[wiselp]

Ok, I am new to all this, but what is the appeal of a louder bike? What is wrong with riding on a bike that "sounds like a sewing machine?" (although the KLR doesn't sound like that at all, of course). I am really curious about the point of all the noise. Excess noise from a motorcycle is proven NOT to enhance your "manhood", make you more attractive, thinner, stop balding, taller, shorter, a better lover, or fix anything else you don't like about yourself. It is guaranteed to annoy people to the point of PASSING LEGISLATION to prevent it. From reading this list, it seems a lot of people lean toward the Libertarian side of things. Loud pipes just give the government another excuse to legislate the lives of citizens. And good for them, since it seems like we are unable to do it for ourselves, unable to take responsibility for us and those of us we live with. Honestly, it reflects terribly on those of us who ride because we enjoy it. It is a motorcycle, a tool to get you from point A to point B, not some unalienable right to pollute everything within a 1/2 mile radius with physically painful noise. Is that a difficult concept? Sorry for the rant, but I am tired of all this crap, the "I have the right to do this, the right to do that". No. You don't. You have the right to respect the lives of the free citizens around you, the right to act civilized, the right to act like a human being.

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Chait" wrote: > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kerry Stottlemyer" kcstott00@... > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 5:33 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: performance upgrades - Just to make noise > > > > > PS Do you think we might have been trolled? (on the issue of noise) > > > No I think that some of you misunderstood the original post. > > An aftermarket pipe that is LEGAL to own and mount on your bike is > not going to be obnoxiously loud unless you are using a tunable pipe > and you purposely made it louder by tuning it wrong. > This is not my intent. If that's what I wanted I WOULD run drag pipes > on the bike and burn my valves. Something I don't want to do. > > Let me explain it a little better. > I've read a few posts here that people didn't like the noise level of > aftermarket pipes. Now after reading on a few other sights and this > one the average agreement was that if the pipe was tuned right (if > it's a tunable unit) it was only slightly louder then stock. If it's > only slightly louder then stock how can it be to loud? Once again > I'll say I don't want an ear splitting imitating Harley exhaust tone. > I just want the bike to breath a bit better and if it just so happens > to make the bike a bit louder ( and I do mean just a bit louder) > again OH WELL!!! it's not like I'm running drag pipes. Some here seem > to think I want to run this thing wide open and uncorked. Uhh no not > even in the least. My question was why are we so concerned with the > sound level of our bikes if it's only a bit louder then stock? > > Yes I agree there is no reason to have a bike that is creating noise > above 95 or more dB. There is just no gain if the exhaust system is > designed right. But again I feel you misunderstood how loud loud is. > Maybe I'll get the dB meter from work and do some testing. > > Kerry > > ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo > > > Don't bother Kerry. > > There are some on this list who believe in "stock or nothing" and you're not > going to convince them otherwise. > > As with most extremists, they are not interested in reason or that there is > a middle-ground in this argument. They are only interested in continuing to > bray their party line. > > ed > A17 >

[revmaaatin]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "wiselp" wrote: SNIP > Sorry for the rant, but I am tired of all this crap, the "I have the > right to do this, the right to do that". No. You don't. You have the > right to respect the lives of the free citizens around you, the right to > act civilized, the right to act like a human being. > Wiselp, Very nicely said, etal. I do believe you would have made a proper impression on the ancient 'Greek-masses' if you were to make this argument while standing on Mars Hill. Conversely, we are more like Romans than Greeks, and it will require the tyranny of Rome to make some of our readers, truly civilized, at least civilized by a Greek standard. Voltaire brought us the idea, that you have the right to do what ever we want. What he failed to fully explain, was that the one's with the most money, or the most political power, had all the 'rights'. revmaaatin.

[C L Cooper]

Best post I've seen on this obviously controversial topic. I suppose the reason it's controversial is that it has a lot to do with opinions and personality. Hard to quantify subjectivity of sound/noise "quality". You're correct though, in that failure to modulate will result in propensity to legislate. ...and we all know how well thought out, rational, equitable and "un-ear-marked" the legislative process is. Conjure up in your mind if you will a young, intelligent, well coiffed, attractive, energetic lobbyist (male or female, depending on the situation - and if you believe that it's a mistake or accident as to who is hired as a lobbyist and what their assignments are, I have some ocean front property in the Mojave Desert I'd like to sell you) doing their best to represent their noise hating, well heeled constituency to legislators who have demonstrated time and again only the highest level of integrity (choke, choke). Then consider what the percentage of motorcycle on and off-road enthusiasts are of the total * voting* population (I wonder what the stats are on bikers who vote?). The worst possible situation is to give the angry mob a target and then to let the issue get into the hands of lawyers. Seems to me that ultimately it gets down to a choice between riding the motorcycle and being a little overly noise conscious, or being deef and not riding. What was that you said, I can't hear ya, talk a little louder, speak up dammit.... ;~) Chuck C San Diego, CA

On 2/2/07, wiselp wrote: > > Ok, I am new to all this, but what is the appeal of a louder bike? What > is wrong with riding on a bike that "sounds like a sewing machine?" > (although the KLR doesn't sound like that at all, of course). I am > really curious about the point of all the noise. Excess noise from a > motorcycle is proven NOT to enhance your "manhood", make you more > attractive, thinner, stop balding, taller, shorter, a better lover, or > fix anything else you don't like about yourself. It is guaranteed to > annoy people to the point of PASSING LEGISLATION to prevent it. From > reading this list, it seems a lot of people lean toward the Libertarian > side of things. Loud pipes just give the government another excuse to > legislate the lives of citizens. And good for them, since it seems > like we are unable to do it for ourselves, unable to take responsibility > for us and those of us we live with. Honestly, it reflects terribly on > those of us who ride because we enjoy it. It is a motorcycle, a tool to > get you from point A to point B, not some unalienable right to pollute > everything within a 1/2 mile radius with physically painful noise. Is > that a difficult concept? > Sorry for the rant, but I am tired of all this crap, the "I have the > right to do this, the right to do that". No. You don't. You have the > right to respect the lives of the free citizens around you, the right to > act civilized, the right to act like a human being. > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com , "Ed > Chait" wrote: > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Kerry Stottlemyer" kcstott00@... > > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 5:33 PM > > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: performance upgrades - Just to make noise > > > > > > > > > PS Do you think we might have been trolled? (on the issue of noise) > > > > > > No I think that some of you misunderstood the original post. > > > > An aftermarket pipe that is LEGAL to own and mount on your bike is > > not going to be obnoxiously loud unless you are using a tunable pipe > > and you purposely made it louder by tuning it wrong. > > This is not my intent. If that's what I wanted I WOULD run drag pipes > > on the bike and burn my valves. Something I don't want to do. > > > > Let me explain it a little better. > > I've read a few posts here that people didn't like the noise level of > > aftermarket pipes. Now after reading on a few other sights and this > > one the average agreement was that if the pipe was tuned right (if > > it's a tunable unit) it was only slightly louder then stock. If it's > > only slightly louder then stock how can it be to loud? Once again > > I'll say I don't want an ear splitting imitating Harley exhaust tone. > > I just want the bike to breath a bit better and if it just so happens > > to make the bike a bit louder ( and I do mean just a bit louder) > > again OH WELL!!! it's not like I'm running drag pipes. Some here seem > > to think I want to run this thing wide open and uncorked. Uhh no not > > even in the least. My question was why are we so concerned with the > > sound level of our bikes if it's only a bit louder then stock? > > > > Yes I agree there is no reason to have a bike that is creating noise > > above 95 or more dB. There is just no gain if the exhaust system is > > designed right. But again I feel you misunderstood how loud loud is. > > Maybe I'll get the dB meter from work and do some testing. > > > > Kerry > > > > ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo > > > > > > Don't bother Kerry. > > > > There are some on this list who believe in "stock or nothing" and > you're not > > going to convince them otherwise. > > > > As with most extremists, they are not interested in reason or that > there is > > a middle-ground in this argument. They are only interested in > continuing to > > bray their party line. > > > > ed > > A17 > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bogdan Swider]

> > > Voltaire brought us the idea, that you have the right to do what ever > we want. What he failed to fully explain, was that the one's with > the most money, or the most political power, had all the 'rights'. > > revmaaatin. > >

William Blake had some thoughts on V, as he wrote below: Mock on, mock on, Voltaire, Rousseau: Mock on, mock on: tis all in vain! You throw the sand against the wind, And the wind blows it back again. And every sand becomes a Gem, Reflected in the beam divine; Blown back they blind the mocking Eye, But still in Israel s paths they shine. The Atoms of Democritus And the Newton s Particles of Light Are sands upon the Red Sea shore, Where Israel s tents do shine so bright [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Douglas Bouley]

Bogdan, Just when I thought I couldn't stand any more of the current round of you-suck-no-you-suck interplay, someone comes along and quotes Blake! Thank-you for the bright spot. This list, like the KLR, is amazingly well-rounded. doug in dc - who is also well-rounded, but in a different way... Bogdan Swider wrote:

>> Voltaire brought us the idea, that you have the right to do what ever >> we want. What he failed to fully explain, was that the one's with >> the most money, or the most political power, had all the 'rights'. >> >> revmaaatin. >> >> >> > William Blake had some thoughts on V, as he wrote below: > > > Mock on, mock on, Voltaire, Rousseau: > Mock on, mock on: OEtis all in vain! > You throw the sand against the wind, > And the wind blows it back again. > > And every sand becomes a Gem, > Reflected in the beam divine; > Blown back they blind the mocking Eye, > But still in Israel s paths they shine. > > The Atoms of Democritus > And the Newton s Particles of Light > Are sands upon the Red Sea shore, > Where Israel s tents do shine so bright > > >

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Don S]

In full appreciation of the wisdom of your post, I regret to advise you that your appeal will certainly register with the sensible, respectful and understanding members of the group. The problem is, I suspect that those participants are not your target audience. As I have mentioned in my many previous rants, your chances of getting the attention of the "loud pipe" crowd is an effort in futility. They don't care. They'll carry on with their nonsense until the law does something about them. The sooner the better. Let's hope all motorcyclist are not penalized because of their selfish stupidity. To give you an idea of how ridiculous these imbeciles can be, I have two HD clowns who live across the street from me. They live on the same side of the street about 100 yards apart with one house between them. In the summer, they try to "out loud" each other with their machines in their driveways before the drive off and they don't ride together! These aren't kids either. They're at least in their forties. I've seen and known children with more maturity than those two bozos. One must wonder if they attend "how to be obnoxious' sessions sponsored by the local HD dealership wiselp wrote: Ok, I am new to all this, but what is the appeal of a louder bike? What is wrong with riding on a bike that "sounds like a sewing machine?" (although the KLR doesn't sound like that at all, of course). I am really curious about the point of all the noise. Excess noise from a motorcycle is proven NOT to enhance your "manhood", make you more attractive, thinner, stop balding, taller, shorter, a better lover, or fix anything else you don't like about yourself. It is guaranteed to annoy people to the point of PASSING LEGISLATION to prevent it. From reading this list, it seems a lot of people lean toward the Libertarian side of things. Loud pipes just give the government another excuse to legislate the lives of citizens. And good for them, since it seems like we are unable to do it for ourselves, unable to take responsibility for us and those of us we live with. Honestly, it reflects terribly on those of us who ride because we enjoy it. It is a motorcycle, a tool to get you from point A to point B, not some unalienable right to pollute everything within a 1/2 mile radius with physically painful noise. Is that a difficult concept? Sorry for the rant, but I am tired of all this crap, the "I have the right to do this, the right to do that". No. You don't. You have the right to respect the lives of the free citizens around you, the right to act civilized, the right to act like a human being.

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "Ed Chait" wrote: > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kerry Stottlemyer" kcstott00@... > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 5:33 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: performance upgrades - Just to make noise > > > > > PS Do you think we might have been trolled? (on the issue of noise) > > > No I think that some of you misunderstood the original post. > > An aftermarket pipe that is LEGAL to own and mount on your bike is > not going to be obnoxiously loud unless you are using a tunable pipe > and you purposely made it louder by tuning it wrong. > This is not my intent. If that's what I wanted I WOULD run drag pipes > on the bike and burn my valves. Something I don't want to do. > > Let me explain it a little better. > I've read a few posts here that people didn't like the noise level of > aftermarket pipes. Now after reading on a few other sights and this > one the average agreement was that if the pipe was tuned right (if > it's a tunable unit) it was only slightly louder then stock. If it's > only slightly louder then stock how can it be to loud? Once again > I'll say I don't want an ear splitting imitating Harley exhaust tone. > I just want the bike to breath a bit better and if it just so happens > to make the bike a bit louder ( and I do mean just a bit louder) > again OH WELL!!! it's not like I'm running drag pipes. Some here seem > to think I want to run this thing wide open and uncorked. Uhh no not > even in the least. My question was why are we so concerned with the > sound level of our bikes if it's only a bit louder then stock? > > Yes I agree there is no reason to have a bike that is creating noise > above 95 or more dB. There is just no gain if the exhaust system is > designed right. But again I feel you misunderstood how loud loud is. > Maybe I'll get the dB meter from work and do some testing. > > Kerry > > ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo > > > Don't bother Kerry. > > There are some on this list who believe in "stock or nothing" and you're not > going to convince them otherwise. > > As with most extremists, they are not interested in reason or that there is > a middle-ground in this argument. They are only interested in continuing to > bray their party line. > > ed > A17 > --------------------------------- We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[kestrelfal]

How difficult would it be to make the aftermarket exhaust suppliers meet the sound level requirements already imposed on the motorcycle manufacturers? Can someone make a cool sounding exhaust thats not too loud? What would happen to H-D sales if the aftermarket had to certify the sound levels of their exhaust systems and make them "tamper-proof". A major part of the problem is lack of enforcement. Fwed

[revmaaatin]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Swider wrote:

> > > > > > > Voltaire brought us the idea, that you have the right to do what

ever

> > we want. What he failed to fully explain, was that the one's with > > the most money, or the most political power, had all the 'rights'. > > > > revmaaatin. > > > > > William Blake had some thoughts on V, as he wrote below: > > > Mock on, mock on, Voltaire, Rousseau: > Mock on, mock on: tis all in vain! > You throw the sand against the wind, > And the wind blows it back again. > > And every sand becomes a Gem, > Reflected in the beam divine; > Blown back they blind the mocking Eye, > But still in Israel s paths they shine. > > The Atoms of Democritus > And the Newton s Particles of Light > Are sands upon the Red Sea shore, > Where Israel s tents do shine so bright >

Bogdan, Could you give the citation from 'wince' this cometh? revmaaatin.

[Bogdan Swider]

> >> > >> > >> > Mock on, mock on, Voltaire, Rousseau: >> > Mock on, mock on: tis all in vain! >> > You throw the sand against the wind, >> > And the wind blows it back again. >> > >> > And every sand becomes a Gem, >> > Reflected in the beam divine; >> > Blown back they blind the mocking Eye, >> > But still in Israel s paths they shine. >> > >> > The Atoms of Democritus >> > And the Newton s Particles of Light >> > Are sands upon the Red Sea shore, >> > Where Israel s tents do shine so bright >> > > > Bogdan, > > Could you give the citation from 'wince' this cometh? > > revmaaatin. > > >

I have it in a book of Blake s poems. If you Google the first line it ll come up, or here http://www.poetryloverspage.com/poets/blake/mock_on_mock_on_voltaire.html Bogdan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Douglas Bouley]

Author: Blake, William Attribution: William Blake (1757--1827), British poet, painter, mystic. Mock On, Mock On, Voltaire, Rousseau (l. 1--2). . . The Complete Poems [William Blake]. Alicia Ostriker, ed. (1977) Penguin Books. http://education.yahoo.com/reference/quotations/quote/17555 revmaaatin wrote:

> --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Bogdan Swider wrote: > >>> Voltaire brought us the idea, that you have the right to do what >>> > ever > >>> we want. What he failed to fully explain, was that the one's with >>> the most money, or the most political power, had all the 'rights'. >>> >>> revmaaatin. >>> >>> >>> >> William Blake had some thoughts on V, as he wrote below: >> >> >> Mock on, mock on, Voltaire, Rousseau: >> Mock on, mock on: OEtis all in vain! >> You throw the sand against the wind, >> And the wind blows it back again. >> >> And every sand becomes a Gem, >> Reflected in the beam divine; >> Blown back they blind the mocking Eye, >> But still in Israel s paths they shine. >> >> The Atoms of Democritus >> And the Newton s Particles of Light >> Are sands upon the Red Sea shore, >> Where Israel s tents do shine so bright >> >> > > Bogdan, > > Could you give the citation from 'wince' this cometh? > > revmaaatin. > > > > > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > Member Map at: http://www.frappr.com/dsnklr650 > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

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