brake pads: who uses what

[ron criswell]

People will hate me but I agree on the noise in the blind spot. I always know where that Harley is in that blind spot. Criswell

On Saturday, August 6, 2005, at 09:44 PM, Kip C. Anderson wrote: > I really don't see the point in even making the arguement about noise > and > 'giving motorcyclists a bad name'. The fact is: You can choose to > make > your bike noisy or not, but whichever you decide, somebody else will > do it, > and people will make their judgements based upon THEM - not > necessarily YOU. > > Your conscience should be your guide, not what people who don't even > know > you think - unless of course your noise levels violate your local > statutes, > in which case it's between you and law enforcement. > > Frankly, my KLR has seen nearly 60,000 miles on the stock system and > will > probably end up a little noisier at some point in the near future > because > yes, it can reduce accidents. I'll grant that statistics may not > support > it, but for that brief moment I move through a blind spot, a louder > exhaust > provides an additional clue to the Last Minute Larry's who would change > lanes into me that they better look around a little more thoroughly > before > doing it. > > - > Kip > Eugene, OR > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Ryder" > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:58 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. > Impossible? > (probably NKLR) > > >> Thanks for the reply. For the record I'm fairly learned and >> comfortable in my ethics. My query was meant to be more of a >> technical one and not a political/ethical one. I probably shouldn't >> have even mentioned "why" I want my bike louder as that really may >> have clouded the point of the post. >> >> I realize the politically correct crowd is well intentioned and >> appreciate their efforts to attempt to make the world a better place >> for us all, opposite people who see the world burning and sit back >> and do nothing and say nothing; I mean that in all sincerity. At the >> same time I personally prefer to confine my own discussions of >> politics and ethics to threads dedicated thereto rather then >> potentially bog down every single thread in topics nowhere near what >> the originator intended to discuss. For that reason in the future >> when I ask something like how to make my KLR louder and get multiple >> responses that assume I haven't thoroughly considered all ethical >> ramifications at length and need assistance in determining how to be >> a good person, I will probably ignore such off-topic replies. I >> truly do not mean to be offensive. I just want to explain why I will >> may not respond to such replies in the future, and move on from there. >> >> I typically participate in good ethical debates in threads of their >> own. I am an avid amateur herpitologist (I keep and breed reptiles) >> and have posted to rec.pets.herp on usenet for...easily 15 years+. >> As you might imagine I am not new to newsgroup ethical debates, but I >> believe they have their place and time lest newsgroups will prove >> utterly useless as a wasteland for flames not unlike hell itself. >> >> Again, I appreciate your taking the time to reply to me. All the >> best... >> >> PS - I wasn't going to reply to this however I'm getting some replies >> sent to me personally and wanted to answer everyone in one shot. >> >> -Bill R. > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > >

[Ramey]

Ron, hate is too intense, possibly inappropriate. Maybe-dislike a lot, can't stand, wonder where his head is, too much Texas heat. On the other hand..... Zac -----Original Message----- From: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Ron Criswell Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 9:32 AM To: Kip C. Anderson Cc: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ethics and Bad Name Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. Impossible? (probably NKLR) People will hate me but I agree on the noise in the blind spot. I always know where that Harley is in that blind spot. Criswell

On Saturday, August 6, 2005, at 09:44 PM, Kip C. Anderson wrote: > I really don't see the point in even making the arguement about noise > and > 'giving motorcyclists a bad name'. The fact is: You can choose to > make > your bike noisy or not, but whichever you decide, somebody else will > do it, > and people will make their judgements based upon THEM - not > necessarily YOU. > > Your conscience should be your guide, not what people who don't even > know > you think - unless of course your noise levels violate your local > statutes, > in which case it's between you and law enforcement. > > Frankly, my KLR has seen nearly 60,000 miles on the stock system and > will > probably end up a little noisier at some point in the near future > because > yes, it can reduce accidents. I'll grant that statistics may not > support > it, but for that brief moment I move through a blind spot, a louder > exhaust > provides an additional clue to the Last Minute Larry's who would change > lanes into me that they better look around a little more thoroughly > before > doing it. > > - > Kip > Eugene, OR > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Ryder" > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:58 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. > Impossible? > (probably NKLR) > > >> Thanks for the reply. For the record I'm fairly learned and >> comfortable in my ethics. My query was meant to be more of a >> technical one and not a political/ethical one. I probably shouldn't >> have even mentioned "why" I want my bike louder as that really may >> have clouded the point of the post. >> >> I realize the politically correct crowd is well intentioned and >> appreciate their efforts to attempt to make the world a better place >> for us all, opposite people who see the world burning and sit back >> and do nothing and say nothing; I mean that in all sincerity. At the >> same time I personally prefer to confine my own discussions of >> politics and ethics to threads dedicated thereto rather then >> potentially bog down every single thread in topics nowhere near what >> the originator intended to discuss. For that reason in the future >> when I ask something like how to make my KLR louder and get multiple >> responses that assume I haven't thoroughly considered all ethical >> ramifications at length and need assistance in determining how to be >> a good person, I will probably ignore such off-topic replies. I >> truly do not mean to be offensive. I just want to explain why I will >> may not respond to such replies in the future, and move on from there. >> >> I typically participate in good ethical debates in threads of their >> own. I am an avid amateur herpitologist (I keep and breed reptiles) >> and have posted to rec.pets.herp on usenet for...easily 15 years+. >> As you might imagine I am not new to newsgroup ethical debates, but I >> believe they have their place and time lest newsgroups will prove >> utterly useless as a wasteland for flames not unlike hell itself. >> >> Again, I appreciate your taking the time to reply to me. All the >> best... >> >> PS - I wasn't going to reply to this however I'm getting some replies >> sent to me personally and wanted to answer everyone in one shot. >> >> -Bill R. > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html Yahoo! Groups Links

[Rick McCauley]

Loud pipes can just as easily scare an elderly person at the last minute, and make them react in a negative way. The best way to avoid an accident is to ride passively, and defensively. In other words, keep your eyes open, and constantly scanning. If a jerk does something stupid, let him have his way. You may be right, but don't be dead right. How many times has someone been a real bone head, and you think to yourself; where's a cop when you want one? Sometimes I wish I had a Vickers .50 cal. machine gun on my vehicle. Rick A17 Ron Criswell wrote: People will hate me but I agree on the noise in the blind spot. I always know where that Harley is in that blind spot. Criswell

On Saturday, August 6, 2005, at 09:44 PM, Kip C. Anderson wrote: > I really don't see the point in even making the arguement about noise > and > 'giving motorcyclists a bad name'. The fact is: You can choose to > make > your bike noisy or not, but whichever you decide, somebody else will > do it, > and people will make their judgements based upon THEM - not > necessarily YOU. > > Your conscience should be your guide, not what people who don't even > know > you think - unless of course your noise levels violate your local > statutes, > in which case it's between you and law enforcement. > > Frankly, my KLR has seen nearly 60,000 miles on the stock system and > will > probably end up a little noisier at some point in the near future > because > yes, it can reduce accidents. I'll grant that statistics may not > support > it, but for that brief moment I move through a blind spot, a louder > exhaust > provides an additional clue to the Last Minute Larry's who would change > lanes into me that they better look around a little more thoroughly > before > doing it. > > - > Kip > Eugene, OR > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Ryder" > To: > Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:58 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. > Impossible? > (probably NKLR) > > >> Thanks for the reply. For the record I'm fairly learned and >> comfortable in my ethics. My query was meant to be more of a >> technical one and not a political/ethical one. I probably shouldn't >> have even mentioned "why" I want my bike louder as that really may >> have clouded the point of the post. >> >> I realize the politically correct crowd is well intentioned and >> appreciate their efforts to attempt to make the world a better place >> for us all, opposite people who see the world burning and sit back >> and do nothing and say nothing; I mean that in all sincerity. At the >> same time I personally prefer to confine my own discussions of >> politics and ethics to threads dedicated thereto rather then >> potentially bog down every single thread in topics nowhere near what >> the originator intended to discuss. For that reason in the future >> when I ask something like how to make my KLR louder and get multiple >> responses that assume I haven't thoroughly considered all ethical >> ramifications at length and need assistance in determining how to be >> a good person, I will probably ignore such off-topic replies. I >> truly do not mean to be offensive. I just want to explain why I will >> may not respond to such replies in the future, and move on from there. >> >> I typically participate in good ethical debates in threads of their >> own. I am an avid amateur herpitologist (I keep and breed reptiles) >> and have posted to rec.pets.herp on usenet for...easily 15 years+. >> As you might imagine I am not new to newsgroup ethical debates, but I >> believe they have their place and time lest newsgroups will prove >> utterly useless as a wasteland for flames not unlike hell itself. >> >> Again, I appreciate your taking the time to reply to me. All the >> best... >> >> PS - I wasn't going to reply to this however I'm getting some replies >> sent to me personally and wanted to answer everyone in one shot. >> >> -Bill R. > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html Yahoo! Groups Links __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[ron criswell]

I once was considering getting back into street riding but was hesitant about getting run over (again). A guy that used to work on my bike and built up race bikes just said "Go faster than the cages and you won't get run over." Some truth to that. Get out and away from traffic and keep a pocket of air (as much as you can) seems to me the best way to go. I think if you ride slow and careful you will get run over. Jes my theory. Criswell

On Sunday, August 7, 2005, at 10:22 AM, Rick McCauley wrote: > Loud pipes can just as easily scare an elderly person at the last > minute, and make them react in a negative way. The best way to avoid > an accident is to ride passively, and defensively. In other words, > keep your eyes open, and constantly scanning. If a jerk does something > stupid, let him have his way. You may be right, but don't be dead > right. How many times has someone been a real bone head, and you think > to yourself; where's a cop when you want one? Sometimes I wish I had a > Vickers .50 cal. machine gun on my vehicle. > > Rick A17 > > Ron Criswell wrote: > People will hate me but I agree on the noise in the blind spot. I > always know where that Harley is in that blind spot. > > Criswell > On Saturday, August 6, 2005, at 09:44 PM, Kip C. Anderson wrote: > >> I really don't see the point in even making the arguement about noise >> and >> 'giving motorcyclists a bad name'. The fact is: You can choose to >> make >> your bike noisy or not, but whichever you decide, somebody else will >> do it, >> and people will make their judgements based upon THEM - not >> necessarily YOU. >> >> Your conscience should be your guide, not what people who don't even >> know >> you think - unless of course your noise levels violate your local >> statutes, >> in which case it's between you and law enforcement. >> >> Frankly, my KLR has seen nearly 60,000 miles on the stock system and >> will >> probably end up a little noisier at some point in the near future >> because >> yes, it can reduce accidents. I'll grant that statistics may not >> support >> it, but for that brief moment I move through a blind spot, a louder >> exhaust >> provides an additional clue to the Last Minute Larry's who would >> change >> lanes into me that they better look around a little more thoroughly >> before >> doing it. >> >> - >> Kip >> Eugene, OR >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bill Ryder" >> To: >> Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:58 PM >> Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. >> Impossible? >> (probably NKLR) >> >> >>> Thanks for the reply. For the record I'm fairly learned and >>> comfortable in my ethics. My query was meant to be more of a >>> technical one and not a political/ethical one. I probably shouldn't >>> have even mentioned "why" I want my bike louder as that really may >>> have clouded the point of the post. >>> >>> I realize the politically correct crowd is well intentioned and >>> appreciate their efforts to attempt to make the world a better place >>> for us all, opposite people who see the world burning and sit back >>> and do nothing and say nothing; I mean that in all sincerity. At the >>> same time I personally prefer to confine my own discussions of >>> politics and ethics to threads dedicated thereto rather then >>> potentially bog down every single thread in topics nowhere near what >>> the originator intended to discuss. For that reason in the future >>> when I ask something like how to make my KLR louder and get multiple >>> responses that assume I haven't thoroughly considered all ethical >>> ramifications at length and need assistance in determining how to be >>> a good person, I will probably ignore such off-topic replies. I >>> truly do not mean to be offensive. I just want to explain why I will >>> may not respond to such replies in the future, and move on from >>> there. >>> >>> I typically participate in good ethical debates in threads of their >>> own. I am an avid amateur herpitologist (I keep and breed reptiles) >>> and have posted to rec.pets.herp on usenet for...easily 15 years+. >>> As you might imagine I am not new to newsgroup ethical debates, but I >>> believe they have their place and time lest newsgroups will prove >>> utterly useless as a wasteland for flames not unlike hell itself. >>> >>> Again, I appreciate your taking the time to reply to me. All the >>> best... >>> >>> PS - I wasn't going to reply to this however I'm getting some replies >>> sent to me personally and wanted to answer everyone in one shot. >>> >>> -Bill R. >> >> >> >> Archive Quicksearch at: >> http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html >> List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com >> List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html >> >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

[Chris]

Exactly. A generalization for sure, but most of the open pipe types that I notice in my blind spot are hanging there below the pace of traffic and keeping me from changing lanes when I should be able to. A rider doesn't belong in a blind spot to begin with, with about the only exception being a bumper to bumper jam on a freeway. I use my gas between cars and make damn sure I'm not where I shouldn't be. I don't need loud pipes to alert people to my driving mistakes. I keep myself safe and don't rely on the other drivers to do so. I just got home after riding behind Joe Electraglide with open pipes and doing about five under the limit obstructing traffic. Of course he had to sit there revving out the throttle at each stop too. All that does is piss off the public. The _one_ loud bike that takes off down the highway here is the one that I notice and it sticks in my mind, just consider what the non-riding public thinks.

On 8/7/05, Ron Criswell wrote: > I once was considering getting back into street riding but was hesitant > about getting run over (again). A guy that used to work on my bike and > built up race bikes just said "Go faster than the cages and you won't > get run over." Some truth to that. Get out and away from traffic and > keep a pocket of air (as much as you can) seems to me the best way to > go. I think if you ride slow and careful you will get run over. Jes my > theory. > > Criswell > On Sunday, August 7, 2005, at 10:22 AM, Rick McCauley wrote: > > > Loud pipes can just as easily scare an elderly person at the last > > minute, and make them react in a negative way. The best way to avoid > > an accident is to ride passively, and defensively. In other words, > > keep your eyes open, and constantly scanning. If a jerk does something > > stupid, let him have his way. You may be right, but don't be dead > > right. How many times has someone been a real bone head, and you think > > to yourself; where's a cop when you want one? Sometimes I wish I had a > > Vickers .50 cal. machine gun on my vehicle. > > > > Rick A17 > > > > Ron Criswell wrote: > > People will hate me but I agree on the noise in the blind spot. I > > always know where that Harley is in that blind spot. > > > > Criswell > > On Saturday, August 6, 2005, at 09:44 PM, Kip C. Anderson wrote: > > > >> I really don't see the point in even making the arguement about noise > >> and > >> 'giving motorcyclists a bad name'. The fact is: You can choose to > >> make > >> your bike noisy or not, but whichever you decide, somebody else will > >> do it, > >> and people will make their judgements based upon THEM - not > >> necessarily YOU. > >> > >> Your conscience should be your guide, not what people who don't even > >> know > >> you think - unless of course your noise levels violate your local > >> statutes, > >> in which case it's between you and law enforcement. > >> > >> Frankly, my KLR has seen nearly 60,000 miles on the stock system and > >> will > >> probably end up a little noisier at some point in the near future > >> because > >> yes, it can reduce accidents. I'll grant that statistics may not > >> support > >> it, but for that brief moment I move through a blind spot, a louder > >> exhaust > >> provides an additional clue to the Last Minute Larry's who would > >> change > >> lanes into me that they better look around a little more thoroughly > >> before > >> doing it. > >> > >> - > >> Kip > >> Eugene, OR > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Bill Ryder" > >> To: > >> Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:58 PM > >> Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. > >> Impossible? > >> (probably NKLR) > >> > >> > >>> Thanks for the reply. For the record I'm fairly learned and > >>> comfortable in my ethics. My query was meant to be more of a > >>> technical one and not a political/ethical one. I probably shouldn't > >>> have even mentioned "why" I want my bike louder as that really may > >>> have clouded the point of the post. > >>> > >>> I realize the politically correct crowd is well intentioned and > >>> appreciate their efforts to attempt to make the world a better place > >>> for us all, opposite people who see the world burning and sit back > >>> and do nothing and say nothing; I mean that in all sincerity. At the > >>> same time I personally prefer to confine my own discussions of > >>> politics and ethics to threads dedicated thereto rather then > >>> potentially bog down every single thread in topics nowhere near what > >>> the originator intended to discuss. For that reason in the future > >>> when I ask something like how to make my KLR louder and get multiple > >>> responses that assume I haven't thoroughly considered all ethical > >>> ramifications at length and need assistance in determining how to be > >>> a good person, I will probably ignore such off-topic replies. I > >>> truly do not mean to be offensive. I just want to explain why I will > >>> may not respond to such replies in the future, and move on from > >>> there. > >>> > >>> I typically participate in good ethical debates in threads of their > >>> own. I am an avid amateur herpitologist (I keep and breed reptiles) > >>> and have posted to rec.pets.herp on usenet for...easily 15 years+. > >>> As you might imagine I am not new to newsgroup ethical debates, but I > >>> believe they have their place and time lest newsgroups will prove > >>> utterly useless as a wasteland for flames not unlike hell itself. > >>> > >>> Again, I appreciate your taking the time to reply to me. All the > >>> best... > >>> > >>> PS - I wasn't going to reply to this however I'm getting some replies > >>> sent to me personally and wanted to answer everyone in one shot. > >>> > >>> -Bill R. > >> > >> > >> > >> Archive Quicksearch at: > >> http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > >> List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > >> List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > >> > >> > >> Yahoo! Groups Links > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > >

[Rick McCauley]

The air pocket tactic is a good one. Going faster than the cages is ok to a point. Try explaining to the officer that you were speeding because it was safer. Good luck. Rick A17 Ron Criswell wrote: "Go faster than the cages and you won't get run over." Some truth to that. Get out and away from traffic and keep a pocket of air (as much as you can) seems to me the best way to go. I think if you ride slow and careful you will get run over. Jes my theory. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[ron criswell]

Unfortunately the non riding public only knows Harley. I know, they constantly ask me when I tell them I'm a motorcycle rider "Do you have a Harley?" And when I tell them Kawasaki they seem disappointed. They then ask when I am going to get one (or the other one that impresses the non riding public - BMW). Brand and image do make an impression. Look what Hitler did with a lot of loud and a good logo. But none the less, loud bikes do piss off some and impresses others. And I always know when a Hog is passing my car without looking. And I try to be very careful passing with my stock muffler KLR. They don't know I'm there. Criswell

On Sunday, August 7, 2005, at 01:13 PM, Chris wrote: > Exactly. A generalization for sure, but most of the open pipe types > that I notice in my blind spot are hanging there below the pace of > traffic and keeping me from changing lanes when I should be able to. > A rider doesn't belong in a blind spot to begin with, with about the > only exception being a bumper to bumper jam on a freeway. > > I use my gas between cars and make damn sure I'm not where I shouldn't > be. I don't need loud pipes to alert people to my driving mistakes. > I keep myself safe and don't rely on the other drivers to do so. > > I just got home after riding behind Joe Electraglide with open pipes > and doing about five under the limit obstructing traffic. Of course > he had to sit there revving out the throttle at each stop too. All > that does is piss off the public. > > The _one_ loud bike that takes off down the highway here is the one > that I notice and it sticks in my mind, just consider what the > non-riding public thinks. > > On 8/7/05, Ron Criswell wrote: >> I once was considering getting back into street riding but was >> hesitant >> about getting run over (again). A guy that used to work on my bike and >> built up race bikes just said "Go faster than the cages and you won't >> get run over." Some truth to that. Get out and away from traffic and >> keep a pocket of air (as much as you can) seems to me the best way to >> go. I think if you ride slow and careful you will get run over. Jes my >> theory. >> >> Criswell >> On Sunday, August 7, 2005, at 10:22 AM, Rick McCauley wrote: >> >>> Loud pipes can just as easily scare an elderly person at the last >>> minute, and make them react in a negative way. The best way to avoid >>> an accident is to ride passively, and defensively. In other words, >>> keep your eyes open, and constantly scanning. If a jerk does >>> something >>> stupid, let him have his way. You may be right, but don't be dead >>> right. How many times has someone been a real bone head, and you >>> think >>> to yourself; where's a cop when you want one? Sometimes I wish I had >>> a >>> Vickers .50 cal. machine gun on my vehicle. >>> >>> Rick A17 >>> >>> Ron Criswell wrote: >>> People will hate me but I agree on the noise in the blind spot. I >>> always know where that Harley is in that blind spot. >>> >>> Criswell >>> On Saturday, August 6, 2005, at 09:44 PM, Kip C. Anderson wrote: >>> >>>> I really don't see the point in even making the arguement about >>>> noise >>>> and >>>> 'giving motorcyclists a bad name'. The fact is: You can choose to >>>> make >>>> your bike noisy or not, but whichever you decide, somebody else will >>>> do it, >>>> and people will make their judgements based upon THEM - not >>>> necessarily YOU. >>>> >>>> Your conscience should be your guide, not what people who don't even >>>> know >>>> you think - unless of course your noise levels violate your local >>>> statutes, >>>> in which case it's between you and law enforcement. >>>> >>>> Frankly, my KLR has seen nearly 60,000 miles on the stock system and >>>> will >>>> probably end up a little noisier at some point in the near future >>>> because >>>> yes, it can reduce accidents. I'll grant that statistics may not >>>> support >>>> it, but for that brief moment I move through a blind spot, a louder >>>> exhaust >>>> provides an additional clue to the Last Minute Larry's who would >>>> change >>>> lanes into me that they better look around a little more thoroughly >>>> before >>>> doing it. >>>> >>>> - >>>> Kip >>>> Eugene, OR >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Bill Ryder" >>>> To: >>>> Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:58 PM >>>> Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. >>>> Impossible? >>>> (probably NKLR) >>>> >>>> >>>>> Thanks for the reply. For the record I'm fairly learned and >>>>> comfortable in my ethics. My query was meant to be more of a >>>>> technical one and not a political/ethical one. I probably shouldn't >>>>> have even mentioned "why" I want my bike louder as that really may >>>>> have clouded the point of the post. >>>>> >>>>> I realize the politically correct crowd is well intentioned and >>>>> appreciate their efforts to attempt to make the world a better >>>>> place >>>>> for us all, opposite people who see the world burning and sit back >>>>> and do nothing and say nothing; I mean that in all sincerity. At >>>>> the >>>>> same time I personally prefer to confine my own discussions of >>>>> politics and ethics to threads dedicated thereto rather then >>>>> potentially bog down every single thread in topics nowhere near >>>>> what >>>>> the originator intended to discuss. For that reason in the future >>>>> when I ask something like how to make my KLR louder and get >>>>> multiple >>>>> responses that assume I haven't thoroughly considered all ethical >>>>> ramifications at length and need assistance in determining how to >>>>> be >>>>> a good person, I will probably ignore such off-topic replies. I >>>>> truly do not mean to be offensive. I just want to explain why I >>>>> will >>>>> may not respond to such replies in the future, and move on from >>>>> there. >>>>> >>>>> I typically participate in good ethical debates in threads of their >>>>> own. I am an avid amateur herpitologist (I keep and breed reptiles) >>>>> and have posted to rec.pets.herp on usenet for...easily 15 years+. >>>>> As you might imagine I am not new to newsgroup ethical debates, >>>>> but I >>>>> believe they have their place and time lest newsgroups will prove >>>>> utterly useless as a wasteland for flames not unlike hell itself. >>>>> >>>>> Again, I appreciate your taking the time to reply to me. All the >>>>> best... >>>>> >>>>> PS - I wasn't going to reply to this however I'm getting some >>>>> replies >>>>> sent to me personally and wanted to answer everyone in one shot. >>>>> >>>>> -Bill R. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Archive Quicksearch at: >>>> http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html >>>> List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com >>>> List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html >>>> >>>> >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Archive Quicksearch at: >>> http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html >>> List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com >>> List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html >>> >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> __________________________________________________ >>> Do You Yahoo!? >>> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>> http://mail.yahoo.com >>> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>> >>> >>> >>> Archive Quicksearch at: >>> http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html >>> List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com >>> List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html >>> >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Archive Quicksearch at: >> http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html >> List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com >> List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html >> >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

[Ed Chait]

----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Ryder" To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:31 PM Subject: Ethics and Bad Name Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. Impossible? (probably NKLR) > Now we're getting at solutions! Communicate to the public about why > we want loud, and start fitting bikes with a quiet/loud dohickey. > Come on you "please keep your bike non-offensive" people. Take that > frown and turn it up-side-down. The sky is not falling. We just > need social innovation. > > Now get me talking about global warming and my argument would take a > 180 degree turn. There is no solution that includes dumping whatever > you want, whenever you want into the environment. But loud bikes > aren't causing cancer and disease. > > Hey, you guys started it. Hate to see what emails I get if I ask how > to change the oil. "Someone might see you changing the oil and > assume you'll pour it down the drain; only qulified cycle techs at > dealerships should change oil." (Am I endearing you guys to > myself, or starting to P*** everyone off...yet? Talking mainly to > the PC crew. I'm sure the loud exhaust guys are laughing...or at > least not P***ed off. > > > -Bill I think it pisses them off when I refer to the stock exhaust as sounding like a "sewing machine." I should refrain from doing that. After all, we have a certain fondness for our KLR's, and nobody likes having it equated with a sewing machine. Even though it does sound like one. heheheheheheh, ed A17

[Cloyce D. Spradling]

On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 08:01:04PM -0700, Ed Chait wrote: : I think it pisses them off when I refer to the stock exhaust as sounding : like a "sewing machine." I should refrain from doing that. Damn right! It doesn't sound like a sewing machine (that's a BMW K-bike). The stock KLR exhaust sounds like a lawn mower. Unless you've got a tweety, then it sounds like an old VW bug. BTW, am I allowed to dislike loud pipes, think they're a Bad Idea, and not be PC? Or does one necessarily imply the other? I just want to know so I can figure out if I need to get another patch for my riding jacket. -- Cloyce A13 (VW-style) in Austin

[Ramey]

If you were to clone a hog, rather then a chicken, you'd have, of course, what else, a bunch of Harleys. Zac -----Original Message----- From: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Bill Ryder Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:20 PM To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Subject: Ethics and Bad Name Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. Impossible? (probably NKLR) I swear I don't want to even debate this, but I have to chime in and ask a question. Couldn't you're arguement as stated be used to call for outlawing car horns? Do you check on the age of the person about to run into you before you hit your car's horn because maybe it will make things worse? Why is the assumption that alerting someone that you are near, with sound, can not possibly be a positive? Does not every street legal vehicle made have a horn? I'm not asking "why shouldn't bikes be as loud as car horns?" I'm asking "why do so many people seem to dismiss the possibility that a louder bike might be safer?" Can anyone quote research statistics? What I sense is fear. People seem to fear motorcyclist's rights being taken away by people who have no interest in motorcycles. Rather than fight your own, and seperate and divide us into Harley vs. X, or hooligan vs. Y, why not work to educate the public...the people who don't know any better, that the reason we want our bike louder is that we are attmepting to be more safe? In the end if each of us is arguing from a foundation of opinion on whether louder bikes are safer, than we are all entitled to our own opinions and to each his own. Individule rights are a cornerstone of the free world's existance. Are any of your living in the People's Republic of China? Oh for God sakes...please don't get me started. I'm just so good at winning political debates...and no one but me seems to believe so. Haha. I just wanted to know how to make my bike louder. God forbid I find need to ask how to clone a chicken or something. -Bill --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Rick McCauley wrote:

> Loud pipes can just as easily scare an elderly person at the last

minute, and make them react in a negative way. The best way to avoid an accident is to ride passively, and defensively. In other words, keep your eyes open, and constantly scanning. If a jerk does something stupid, let him have his way. You may be right, but don't be dead right. How many times has someone been a real bone head, and you think to yourself; where's a cop when you want one? Sometimes I wish I had a Vickers .50 cal. machine gun on my vehicle.

> > Rick A17 > > Ron Criswell wrote: > People will hate me but I agree on the noise in the blind spot. I > always know where that Harley is in that blind spot. > > Criswell > On Saturday, August 6, 2005, at 09:44 PM, Kip C. Anderson wrote: > > > I really don't see the point in even making the arguement about

noise

> > and > > 'giving motorcyclists a bad name'. The fact is: You can choose to > > make > > your bike noisy or not, but whichever you decide, somebody else

will

> > do it, > > and people will make their judgements based upon THEM - not > > necessarily YOU. > > > > Your conscience should be your guide, not what people who don't

even

> > know > > you think - unless of course your noise levels violate your local > > statutes, > > in which case it's between you and law enforcement. > > > > Frankly, my KLR has seen nearly 60,000 miles on the stock system

and

> > will > > probably end up a little noisier at some point in the near future > > because > > yes, it can reduce accidents. I'll grant that statistics may not > > support > > it, but for that brief moment I move through a blind spot, a

louder

> > exhaust > > provides an additional clue to the Last Minute Larry's who would

change

> > lanes into me that they better look around a little more

thoroughly

> > before > > doing it. > > > > - > > Kip > > Eugene, OR > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Bill Ryder" > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:58 PM > > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: I'd like louder exhaust, no jetting. > > Impossible? > > (probably NKLR) > > > > > >> Thanks for the reply. For the record I'm fairly learned and > >> comfortable in my ethics. My query was meant to be more of a > >> technical one and not a political/ethical one. I probably

shouldn't

> >> have even mentioned "why" I want my bike louder as that really

may

> >> have clouded the point of the post. > >> > >> I realize the politically correct crowd is well intentioned and > >> appreciate their efforts to attempt to make the world a better

place

> >> for us all, opposite people who see the world burning and sit

back

> >> and do nothing and say nothing; I mean that in all sincerity. At

the

> >> same time I personally prefer to confine my own discussions of > >> politics and ethics to threads dedicated thereto rather then > >> potentially bog down every single thread in topics nowhere near

what

> >> the originator intended to discuss. For that reason in the future > >> when I ask something like how to make my KLR louder and get

multiple

> >> responses that assume I haven't thoroughly considered all ethical > >> ramifications at length and need assistance in determining how

to be

> >> a good person, I will probably ignore such off-topic replies. I > >> truly do not mean to be offensive. I just want to explain why I

will

> >> may not respond to such replies in the future, and move on from

there.

> >> > >> I typically participate in good ethical debates in threads of

their

> >> own. I am an avid amateur herpitologist (I keep and breed

reptiles)

> >> and have posted to rec.pets.herp on usenet for...easily 15

years+.

> >> As you might imagine I am not new to newsgroup ethical debates,

but I

> >> believe they have their place and time lest newsgroups will prove > >> utterly useless as a wasteland for flames not unlike hell itself. > >> > >> Again, I appreciate your taking the time to reply to me. All the > >> best... > >> > >> PS - I wasn't going to reply to this however I'm getting some

replies

> >> sent to me personally and wanted to answer everyone in one shot. > >> > >> -Bill R. > > > > > > > > Archive Quicksearch at: > > http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html > > List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archive Quicksearch at:

http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html

> List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com > List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Archive Quicksearch at: http://www.angelfire.com/ut/moab/klr650_data_search.html List sponsored by Dual Sport News at: www.dualsportnews.com List FAQ courtesy of Chris Krok at: www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html Yahoo! Groups Links