Control Box Terminals

Steve S · Post by **Steve S** » Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:32 pm

Has anyone successfully replace the grub screw terminals on the control box? One of my A terminals has opened up so the screw won't tighten fully. I've bent it closed once already and now it's opened up again so I feel like I'm on borrowed time. The female side is riveted on (if that's the correct term for the way it's attached) and pressed or molded into the plastic. If a replacement terminal is available, it appears I could press the pair of A terminals out together and rivet another one on. But I'm worried about breaking the plastic, and getting a nice tight fit. A bit of solder over the riveted area might not be a bad idea I suppose. Anyone attempt this before? - Steve Simmons, TC8975

ian thomson · Post by **ian thomson** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 1:23 am

Re: "Has anyone successfully replace the grub screw terminals on the control box?" Steve, this is not uncommon. Being brass the terminals are relatively soft and liable to wear. Not being complete circles they are often overtightened at which point they, as you say, become liable to fatigue. For all these reasons you have to be gentle with them. I have never tried to replace them but it might work. Firstly though I would try to find a grub screw which is unworn and therefore fits better. Also I would tin the wire ends so that they grip better on tightening. You could of course go the whole hog and just solder the wires in! It would make things awkward if you need to take them out again but it would solve the problem, and how often do you remove these wires anyway? Good luck Ian Thomson Notts. UK.

Roger Furneaux · Post by **Roger Furneaux** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:40 am

hi Steve, Ian - do NOT solder the wires! It will indeed deform, and be tight initially, but will in time allow the wires to get loose. You could get hold of a cheap RF95 (from a TD, so plentiful) and break it up. This will give you several terminals and two coils (those more fsamiliar with such things will be able to confirm whether or not they are the same as RF91 coils) BTW I have new brass terminal screws! cheers Roger

On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 9:23 AM ian thomson i.thomson@talk21.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Re: "Has anyone successfully replace the grub screw terminals on the control box?" Steve, this is not uncommon. Being brass the terminals are relatively soft and liable to wear. Not being complete circles they are often overtightened at which point they, as you say, become liable to fatigue. For all these reasons you have to be gentle with them. I have never tried to replace them but it might work. Firstly though I would try to find a grub screw which is unworn and therefore fits better. Also I would tin the wire ends so that they grip better on tightening. You could of course go the whole hog and just solder the wires in! It would make things awkward if you need to take them out again but it would solve the problem, and how often do you remove these wires anyway? Good luck Ian Thomson Notts. UK.

Bill Hyatt · Post by **Bill Hyatt** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:13 am

Non OP approved shade tree fix: solder a pigtail to box terminal & at other end of pigtail crimp/solder quick release spade or bullet terminal. On downstream wire end crimp/solder it s corresponding space/bullet terminal. Alternatively, to avoid offending EE s, fit a two post terminal block where convenient , run free end of pigtail with ring terminal to one post of terminal block & fit another ring terminal to bitter end of downstream wire end & other side of terminal block. The end normally secured by grub screw. Be sure to secure wires going into ring terminal to keep them from fatigue flex failure. Bill TC 4926 -Bill Hyatt Sent from my iPhone

ian thomson · Post by **ian thomson** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:02 am

Sorry Roger, I have to disagree with you. The softness of the solder may lead to a slight easing of the tinned wires with the degree of this being affected by how tight they are done up in the first instance. This also happens though when the wires are untinned as the individual strands move relative to one another leading to a slight loosening with time. Tinning will not allow this movement. What I am saying is both methods will allow a degree of loosening with tinning arguably leading to less. Arguably tinning of the ends also allows the strand bundle to conform better to the shape of the pillar and grub screw affording a better contact in spite of the slight easing of the grip. Ian

On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:40 PM +0100, "Roger Furneaux" roger.46tc@gmail.com> wrote: hi Steve, Ian - do NOT solder the wires! It will indeed deform, and be tight initially, but will in time allow the wires to get loose. You could get hold of a cheap RF95 (from a TD, so plentiful) and break it up. This will give you several terminals and two coils (those more fsamiliar with such things will be able to confirm whether or not they are the same as RF91 coils) BTW I have new brass terminal screws! cheers Roger On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 9:23 AM ian thomson i.thomson@talk21.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Re: "Has anyone successfully replace the grub screw terminals on the control box?" Steve, this is not uncommon. Being brass the terminals are relatively soft and liable to wear. Not being complete circles they are often overtightened at which point they, as you say, become liable to fatigue. For all these reasons you have to be gentle with them. I have never tried to replace them but it might work. Firstly though I would try to find a grub screw which is unworn and therefore fits better. Also I would tin the wire ends so that they grip better on tightening. You could of course go the whole hog and just solder the wires in! It would make things awkward if you need to take them out again but it would solve the problem, and how often do you remove these wires anyway? Good luck Ian Thomson Notts. UK.

Peter Cole · Post by **Peter Cole** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:58 am

Guys, The industry standard way to terminate stranded wire is to crimp on a bootlace ferrule. Regards Peter Cole

On Fri, 21 Sep 2018, 6:02 pm ian thomson i.thomson@talk21.com [mg-tabc], mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Sorry Roger, I have to disagree with you. The softness of the solder may lead to a slight easing of the tinned wires with the degree of this being affected by how tight they are done up in the first instance. This also happens though when the wires are untinned as the individual strands move relative to one another leading to a slight loosening with time. Tinning will not allow this movement. What I am saying is both methods will allow a degree of loosening with tinning arguably leading to less. Arguably tinning of the ends also allows the strand bundle to conform better to the shape of the pillar and grub screw affording a better contact in spite of the slight easing of the grip. Ian On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:40 PM +0100, "Roger Furneaux" roger.46tc@gmail.com> wrote: hi Steve, Ian - do NOT solder the wires! It will indeed deform, and be tight initially, but will in time allow the wires to get loose. You could get hold of a cheap RF95 (from a TD, so plentiful) and break it up. This will give you several terminals and two coils (those more fsamiliar with such things will be able to confirm whether or not they are the same as RF91 coils) BTW I have new brass terminal screws! cheers Roger On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 9:23 AM ian thomson i.thomson@talk21.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u]
Re: "Has anyone successfully replace the grub screw terminals on the control box?" Steve, this is not uncommon. Being brass the terminals are relatively soft and liable to wear. Not being complete circles they are often overtightened at which point they, as you say, become liable to fatigue. For all these reasons you have to be gentle with them. I have never tried to replace them but it might work. Firstly though I would try to find a grub screw which is unworn and therefore fits better. Also I would tin the wire ends so that they grip better on tightening. You could of course go the whole hog and just solder the wires in! It would make things awkward if you need to take them out again but it would solve the problem, and how often do you remove these wires anyway? Good luck Ian Thomson Notts. UK.

ian thomson · Post by **ian thomson** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:12 am

True Pete. But it wasn't when our cars were built and the OP would be on our backs if they could see crimps. Tinning is at least out of sight until the cable is disconnected. Ian

On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 5:58 PM +0100, "Peter Cole" pcoleuk@gmail.com> wrote: Guys, The industry standard way to terminate stranded wire is to crimp on a bootlace ferrule. Regards Peter Cole On Fri, 21 Sep 2018, 6:02 pm ian thomson i.thomson@talk21.com [mg-tabc], mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Sorry Roger, I have to disagree with you. The softness of the solder may lead to a slight easing of the tinned wires with the degree of this being affected by how tight they are done up in the first instance. This also happens though when the wires are untinned as the individual strands move relative to one another leading to a slight loosening with time. Tinning will not allow this movement. What I am saying is both methods will allow a degree of loosening with tinning arguably leading to less. Arguably tinning of the ends also allows the strand bundle to conform better to the shape of the pillar and grub screw affording a better contact in spite of the slight easing of the grip. Ian On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:40 PM +0100, "Roger Furneaux" roger.46tc@gmail.com> wrote: hi Steve, Ian - do NOT solder the wires! It will indeed deform, and be tight initially, but will in time allow the wires to get loose. You could get hold of a cheap RF95 (from a TD, so plentiful) and break it up. This will give you several terminals and two coils (those more fsamiliar with such things will be able to confirm whether or not they are the same as RF91 coils) BTW I have new brass terminal screws! cheers Roger On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 9:23 AM ian thomson i.thomson@talk21.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] Re: "Has anyone successfully replace the grub screw terminals on the control box?" Steve, this is not uncommon. Being brass the terminals are relatively soft and liable to wear. Not being complete circles they are often overtightened at which point they, as you say, become liable to fatigue. For all these reasons you have to be gentle with them. I have never tried to replace them but it might work. Firstly though I would try to find a grub screw which is unworn and therefore fits better. Also I would tin the wire ends so that they grip better on tightening. You could of course go the whole hog and just solder the wires in! It would make things awkward if you need to take them out again but it would solve the problem, and how often do you remove these wires anyway? Good luck Ian Thomson Notts. UK.

Joe Curto · Post by **Joe Curto** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:46 pm

I did something like that on MGTD fuse boxes, drill out the rivet side of the bad terminal and then the new one drill and tap 10/32 ( or 2 BA) and insert a screw in from the bottom and screw the terminal in place Joe Curto 718-762-7878 www.joecurto.com -----Original Message----- From: ian thomson i.thomson@talk21.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> To: MG-TABC List mg-tabc@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, Sep 21, 2018 4:23 am Subject: [mg-tabc] Control Box Terminals Re: "Has anyone successfully replace the grub screw terminals on the control box?" Steve, this is not uncommon. Being brass the terminals are relatively soft and liable to wear. Not being complete circles they are often overtightened at which point they, as you say, become liable to fatigue. For all these reasons you have to be gentle with them. I have never tried to replace them but it might work. Firstly though I would try to find a grub screw which is unworn and therefore fits better. Also I would tin the wire ends so that they grip better on tightening. You could of course go the whole hog and just solder the wires in! It would make things awkward if you need to take them out again but it would solve the problem, and how often do you remove these wires anyway? Good luck Ian Thomson Notts. 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Paul Barrow · Post by **Paul Barrow** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:50 pm

Bend it back again gently Steve but this time pack behind both sides with a filler.

Paul

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jan johnson · Post by **jan johnson** » Fri Sep 21, 2018 1:44 pm

Somewhere I saw pictures where someone took a small PETERSEN vise grip

And machined a notch that would squeeze the brass block terminals back into shape! Jan

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