klr wheel bearings

[wdannhardt]

Thanks for all the responses I got regarding the Doohicky fix. I wonder why the spring fails? I can understand the stock doohicky failures: - cheap welded design - soft material - refusal to admit for liability reasons But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once the screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or changes tension. What would cause it to fail? And a better question, why would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for longer life? I read all the posts of people having "peace of mind", but it seems to me that it is misplaced.

[Doug Herr]

On Wed, 18 Oct 2006, wdannhardt wrote:

> Thanks for all the responses I got regarding the Doohicky fix. > > I wonder why the spring fails? I can understand the stock doohicky > failures: > > - cheap welded design > - soft material > - refusal to admit for liability reasons > > But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once the > screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or changes > tension.

If I remember right, the explanation has to do with the loose fit of the stock doo. This causes the spring to basically vibrate during operation.

> What would cause it to fail? And a better question, why > would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the > stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for > longer life?

Mike can fill in on how it is better, but it is indeed better. Plus you have tighter fit for the new doo on the shaft, so there is less vibration in operation. -- Doug Herr doug@...

[wannabsmooth1]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "wdannhardt" wrote:

> > Thanks for all the responses I got regarding the Doohicky fix. > > I wonder why the spring fails? I can understand the stock doohicky > failures: > > - cheap welded design > - soft material > - refusal to admit for liability reasons > > But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once the > screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or changes > tension. What would cause it to fail? And a better question, why > would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the > stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for > longer life? > > I read all the posts of people having "peace of mind", but it seems to > me that it is misplaced. >

The aftermarket springs in my kits are indeed of a different material. The stock springs have sometimes had fairly sharp corner where the wire transitions from the body to the hook. The stock springs are also too long after a few thousand miles, sometimes sooner. Some of us have been to multiple tech days, and worked on enough bikes to have a pretty good feel for what makes these things break. I quit counting wrencing on more than 200 bikes. The current model spring has been in place since 6 months into the program. Only the very first batch (prototypes) had any breakage. These prototypes were actually purchased before I bought the program back, and started selling them under my own name. Jake had a few springs break, as I helped replace them. I realize nuance is smetimes difficult to capture on the internet. Why would you say peace of mind is misplaced? all the best, Mike Eagle Mfg & Eng since 1990

[Thor Lancelot Simon]

On Wed, Oct 18, 2006 at 01:10:49PM -0000, wdannhardt wrote:

> > But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load.

Actually, it is cycled. There is some slop in both ends of the connection. You can tighten up the doohickey end if you get a special doohickey made for a press-fit, but you may not want to. The balancer system used to have a cush drive at the other end to absorb the shock at each end of its maximum travel, but the springs in that cush drive tended to break, and in 1996 they removed it. Devon Jarvis' original doohickey was made for a tight fit -- he had to lightly file it to fit on the shaft in his bike. Eventually he decided that in fact a looser fit might be a better idea. You can probably find his message about this in the list archives. Thor

[Moose]

As I am a lover of things not breaking while I ride them, and learning how to fix my own stuff I would like to attend a wrench day. Even if it is just to watch and help others. Has there been one in the Durham, NC area lately or is there one coming up? Is there a way to find out how many people on the list are in the area? I would have to order the kit and have it ready in advance, but you get enough gearheads together and something will happen! wannabsmooth1 wrote: --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "wdannhardt" wrote:

> > Thanks for all the responses I got regarding the Doohicky fix. > > I wonder why the spring fails? I can understand the stock doohicky > failures: > > - cheap welded design > - soft material > - refusal to admit for liability reasons > > But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once the > screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or changes > tension. What would cause it to fail? And a better question, why > would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the > stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for > longer life? > > I read all the posts of people having "peace of mind", but it seems to > me that it is misplaced. >

The aftermarket springs in my kits are indeed of a different material. The stock springs have sometimes had fairly sharp corner where the wire transitions from the body to the hook. The stock springs are also too long after a few thousand miles, sometimes sooner. Some of us have been to multiple tech days, and worked on enough bikes to have a pretty good feel for what makes these things break. I quit counting wrencing on more than 200 bikes. The current model spring has been in place since 6 months into the program. Only the very first batch (prototypes) had any breakage. These prototypes were actually purchased before I bought the program back, and started selling them under my own name. Jake had a few springs break, as I helped replace them. I realize nuance is smetimes difficult to capture on the internet. Why would you say peace of mind is misplaced? all the best, Mike Eagle Mfg & Eng since 1990 --------------------------------- All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Lars Lemberg]

>But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once the >screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or changes >tension. What would cause it to fail?

In my opinion, vibration from the engine causes motion in the spring. After a time, metal fatigue weakens the material and the spring breaks.

>And a better question, why >would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the >stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for >longer life?

I don't know if it is a different material, but it is a different color material, which could indicate a different material. And it is a different thickness wire. My original spring is .048 in. diameter wire, and the Eagle Mike replacement is .054 in. wire.

>I read all the posts of people having "peace of mind", but it seems to >me that it is misplaced.

We are all sheep at some points in our lives. Lars

[kestrelfal]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Doug Herr wrote:

> > On Wed, 18 Oct 2006, wdannhardt wrote: > > > Thanks for all the responses I got regarding the Doohicky fix. > > > > I wonder why the spring fails? I can understand the stock doohicky > > failures: > > > > - cheap welded design > > - soft material > > - refusal to admit for liability reasons > > > > But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once the > > screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or changes > > tension. > > If I remember right, the explanation has to do with the loose > fit of the stock doo. This causes the spring to basically > vibrate during operation. > > > What would cause it to fail? And a better question, why > > would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the > > stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for > > longer life? > > Mike can fill in on how it is better, but it is indeed better. > Plus you have tighter fit for the new doo on the shaft, so there > is less vibration in operation. > > -- > Doug Herr > doug@... >

A spring under tension can also vibrate. It would be the spring designers job to ensure the spring is thoroughly analyzed and tested for all the vibrations it would be exposed to in service in the KLR's engine to ensure it would not fail due to fatigue. Fred

[wdannhardt]

Thanks Mike, Your advice and experience is really appreciated. I'm a mechanical engineer, so it's in my nature to be cautious especially when we're talking about my precious KLR. I hate opening up the engine to fix this ridiculous problem, but since Kawasaki has not listened to their customers and corrected it, I have no choice. When I fix it, I want to be sure that it will not break again. It sounds like you've got enough experience with it to have "peace of mind", so that goes a long way to convincing me. From what I've read, you stand behind the kit and go the extra mile to satisfy your customers if only Kawasaki would have done that. I guess all that remains is to order the parts. Where do I get them? Thanks, Walt --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "Lars Lemberg" wrote:

> > >But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once

the

> >screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or

changes

> >tension. What would cause it to fail? > > In my opinion, vibration from the engine causes motion in the

spring.

> After a time, metal fatigue weakens the material and the spring

breaks.

> > >And a better question, why > >would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the > >stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for > >longer life? > > I don't know if it is a different material, but it is a different > color material, which could indicate a different material. And it is > a different thickness wire. My original spring is .048 in. diameter > wire, and the Eagle Mike replacement is .054 in. wire. > > >I read all the posts of people having "peace of mind", but it

seems to

> >me that it is misplaced. > > We are all sheep at some points in our lives. > > Lars >

[Yan]

http://www.bigcee.com/klr650faq.html#links look up ArrowHead under OEM Dealers

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "wdannhardt" wrote: > > Thanks Mike, > > Your advice and experience is really appreciated. I'm a mechanical > engineer, so it's in my nature to be cautious especially when we're > talking about my precious KLR. > > I hate opening up the engine to fix this ridiculous problem, but > since Kawasaki has not listened to their customers and corrected it, > I have no choice. When I fix it, I want to be sure that it will not > break again. It sounds like you've got enough experience with it to > have "peace of mind", so that goes a long way to convincing me. From > what I've read, you stand behind the kit and go the extra mile to > satisfy your customers if only Kawasaki would have done that. > > I guess all that remains is to order the parts. Where do I get them? > > Thanks, > Walt > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "Lars Lemberg" > wrote: > > > > >But the spring is not "cycled", it is set at a static load. Once > the > > >screw is tightened on the bracket, the spring never moves or > changes > > >tension. What would cause it to fail? > > > > In my opinion, vibration from the engine causes motion in the > spring. > > After a time, metal fatigue weakens the material and the spring > breaks. > > > > >And a better question, why > > >would we expect the replacement spring to last any longer than the > > >stock? Is the replacement a different material, or shot-peened for > > >longer life? > > > > I don't know if it is a different material, but it is a different > > color material, which could indicate a different material. And it is > > a different thickness wire. My original spring is .048 in. diameter > > wire, and the Eagle Mike replacement is .054 in. wire. > > > > >I read all the posts of people having "peace of mind", but it > seems to > > >me that it is misplaced. > > > > We are all sheep at some points in our lives. > > > > Lars > > >

[W.V. Doran]

Is there a site with directions for removing and installing KLR wheel bearings? TIA WVDoran Scottsdale, AZ --------------------------------- Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]