bad email notice,...subject "welcome to". (non bike)

[Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery]

Go back to what I said. The Spot is a brilliant device but it is only one part of a service. If you are in the middle of the Trans Canadian Trail then having the spot tells people where you are and that you are in trouble. It doesnt mean there is anybody within a few hundred miles that will be able to respond quickly. It is a great service but you must still consider the availability of Services. All it does is let you call for help easier. It doesn't mean help is near. On the up side it makes for fabulous ride reports pictures From: mark ward [mailto:nomad59@...] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 12:33 PM To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com; Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? Hey Sky (Chris) 1st. Riding in the boonies, GET A SPOT, Besides Medical, you can track everywhere you go on Google maps. The "trouble" is/was, Those that have never been, or think they never will be, in any situation, to need help or to help others. Some people are natural Protectors, they keep an eye open at all times to Help others, it's there "way". (Mine) The 2 friends that "NEVER" need anything, also say.... I'm sure someone else will have it If I!!! need it. (in 3 yrs I can easly count 11 times between the 2, just when I was with them.) Aniti Diarea, Many deal with low blood sugar, even when not a Hypoglycemic (ME) or Diabetic, And you can eat all you want, But if diarea ETC. is acting up, YOU SUGARS WILL BE OUT OF WACK. Sometimes you do not know whats happening for Hours!! YOUR FOCUS AND MOOD, WILL BE OFF, when riding etc. Traveling, and strange water, even city water can be an issue.

--- On Wed, 2/6/13, Skypilot wrote: From: Skypilot Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 5:00 PM Digger and all, Now that I am catching up I am reading this over and would suggest a few things. This is a very important topic and I hope we can keep a focus on it without people getting all freaky. I think what is causing so many varried opinions on what to carry is that you have not properly defined the need. It is not local or long distance that differentiates. It is two things. survival vs services First two important points. A first aid kit for a bike needs to survive a lot. It must be kept safe and DRY. the contents must be kept from vibrating. All those canvas bagged kits dont work so put them in the car. I recomend going to someplace like Fuerte cases and buying a hardened plastic case for thisSomething like a seahorse or pelican case. They are very water proof and some compressible foam will stabilize everything inside. That said a large coffee can would do the trick if needed. Water proof is important. Not vibrating to the point of disintegration is important. Next consider where on the bike you put it. Laying on the ground with a dislocated shoulder, broken ribs, leg... and looking at the bike laying on the side where the kit is inside of the side opening cases you will think one thing only, I am an @55 hole. You cant flip the bike over with broken ribs and leg even after you manage to put the shoulder back in. The bike is on the side opening box with the first aid kit so anything you brought is useless. If you need survival, see below, you need to put those pretty side opening cases on a street bike where they belong and get some top opening or soft cases that can be cut open. I have now done this and am no longer that @55 hole! Just saying! OK, So down the rabbit hole we go, are you road riding where people will find you right away and get an ambulance or are you off road. In the road riding some basic stuff is nice but let the abulance get you to a doctor and save the weight. There are services available to cover everything your kit includes. Survival is not an issue since there are cars driving by. Serives are not an issue since someone will help and stores abound. In the local off road bit you need to decide how far out you are. If you need to be able to survive until your wife calls in a search because you missed lunch then you dont need all this. There are services available within 12 hours, probably much less. If you are smart someone rides with you or at least knows where you are. Services in an hour or two. Survival only for that long. If you stand a chance of having to get your self out or wait until those services arrive then survival can be an issue. In that schenario this kit is just about right. I noted some adjustments to consider below but your list sounds like a great kit. A night in the woods mean you need to deal with the broken leg, major cuts and bleeding, dislocated shoulder... If you are 4 miles into the woods with a broken leg, no cell phone coverage and some smashed ribs you are in trouble. Survival is until the services can get to you. That might include not freezing at night and some water to drink. You are no longer on a local ride. You are trying to stay alive so help can reach you. You dont need anti diarea stuff (also services), but you need to stop bleeding and stay put. 4 miles is forever with a broken leg and ribs. Trust me, it is a really long ways. long distance rides things get different. You have the survival thing but you also need the anti diarea and some others. Survival is an Issue and maybe for much longer and services might be non existent. I was glad to have a bottle of Doxycyclin with me in Peru. Some places in Alaska there will be nobody and no abulance for days. No Services. Your kit here must account for long term survival as well as lack of services. Broken legs, bleeding, dislocated shoulder and NOBODY is coming. When they do come you may go to a place with limited service so that imodium or other services based items will not be available. Survival is huge, Services are non existent. You are on your own. This is the big kit. bring everything and learn how to use it. Like I said, consider Survival and Services, then decide how much to carry. Every ride is different so if one kit is all you will do you must account for the majority of rides then add for the ocasional big ride. I have a kit that include sutures, used them once on me and once on a tire, eye irigation, Ace bandages and plaster rolls, rescue breether... It doent come out often and needs to be gone through every time because medical supplies have a shelf life. I ride sweep for our clubs ride, Trail, DS and Adventure rides The Birkshire Trail Riders and you should all come to one this summer. We find riders in all states and have to get them out BUT we only stabilize for transport, no services stuff and no survival stuff in the kit. I ride rallies like the Roaming Rally, 1000 miles of mixed Canadian wildernes and gravel roads but I ride with a team. Need is to stabilize for transport and be able to transport on a bike sometimes, but still no survival, no survices stuff. I have the full kit for when my kids have moved out and I get to go adventuring again, Africa wil likely be my next big one but that is years away. Skypilot, A.K.A. Chris Eckert in CT > From: fw189uhu > Sent: Saturday, February 2, 2013 11:16 PM > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com http://us.mc1847.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=DSN_KLR650%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? > > - Medications (travel size or sample packets), Anti-diarrhea, tylenol... All this is for long range stuff. Not emergencies > o Compact first aid book - read it before you go riding!!!!!!! This is the education thing someone mentioned!!! > o Emergency Mylar thermal blanket - this is important for a clean work area too. lay on the ground under the victims leg... > o Glow snap stick (emergency signaling) - the high intensity ones from major surplus are great but you need an led light too > o Large heavy duty Zip-Loc bag (trash removal) > - Instant cold pack (1) - good idea. I may add one to my rally kit > - Tourniquet (military style Combat Application Tourniquet) - good but a sling will do the same plus hold up an arm > - SAM splint 18" or air splint - I like the SAM but I carry two rolls of 4" casting plaster. mixed with sticks and on one side of a limb then wrap ace bandage around for emergency splint. can also use it to stabilize a foot, hand... In the McGyver category of saving lives this stuff is better than chewing gum and a paper clip > - Moleskin > - Chapstick - Mine has a tube of vasaline style lip stuff that works well to keeps cuts dry and clean too > - Saline vials (not sure about this; drinking water seems OK to me) - I use sealed disposable eye wash bottles that work as wound wash also > ************************************************************ This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, delete this communication and destroy all copies. ************************************************************ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[mark ward]

Middle of No-where. It was mentioned, Survival untill help comes, (If broken leg, ETC ETC.) And if OUT TO FAR it may be days. THATS where a Spot comes in, OUT OF CELL TOWER RANGE. And "No service" can even happen IN town, where hopefully someone will "spot" you. I was laying from waist up, 4 cracked ribs, on a "Popular" paved road, in the Ozarks, NO CELL coverage, & 90 miles from the hospital, and in the next 1.5hrs+- NO cars. I was lucky that time to be with someone who got my bike up so WE could ride to the hospital, (shifting by hand, engine gaurd blocked the shifter.) Got a ticket for $400.+ for leaving the sceen of the accident (Arkansaw S.police) I carry A LARGE kit. (1st aid AND tools, AND......)

--- On Wed, 2/6/13, Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) wrote: From: Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) Subject: RE: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: "mark ward" , DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 6:57 PM Go back to what I said. The Spot is a brilliant device but it is only one part of a service. If you are in the middle of the Trans Canadian Trail then having the spot tells people where you are and that you are in trouble. It doesnt mean there is anybody within a few hundred miles that will be able to respond quickly. It is a great service but you must still consider the availability of Services. All it does is let you call for help easier. It doesn't mean help is near. On the up side it makes for fabulous ride reports pictures From: mark ward [mailto:nomad59@...] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 12:33 PM To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com; Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? Hey Sky (Chris) 1st. Riding in the boonies, GET A SPOT, Besides Medical, you can track everywhere you go on Google maps. The "trouble" is/was, Those that have never been, or think they never will be, in any situation, to need help or to help others. Some people are natural Protectors, they keep an eye open at all times to Help others, it's there "way". (Mine) The 2 friends that "NEVER" need anything, also say.... I'm sure someone else will have it If I!!! need it. (in 3 yrs I can easly count 11 times between the 2, just when I was with them.) Aniti Diarea, Many deal with low blood sugar, even when not a Hypoglycemic (ME) or Diabetic, And you can eat all you want, But if diarea ETC. is acting up, YOU SUGARS WILL BE OUT OF WACK. Sometimes you do not know whats happening for Hours!! YOUR FOCUS AND MOOD, WILL BE OFF, when riding etc. Traveling, and strange water, even city water can be an issue. --- On Wed, 2/6/13, Skypilot chris.eckert@...> wrote: From: Skypilot chris.eckert@...> Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 5:00 PM Digger and all, Now that I am catching up I am reading this over and would suggest a few things. This is a very important topic and I hope we can keep a focus on it without people getting all freaky. I think what is causing so many varried opinions on what to carry is that you have not properly defined the need. It is not local or long distance that differentiates. It is two things. survival vs services First two important points. A first aid kit for a bike needs to survive a lot. It must be kept safe and DRY. the contents must be kept from vibrating. All those canvas bagged kits dont work so put them in the car. I recomend going to someplace like Fuerte cases and buying a hardened plastic case for thisSomething like a seahorse or pelican case. They are very water proof and some compressible foam will stabilize everything inside. That said a large coffee can would do the trick if needed. Water proof is important. Not vibrating to the point of disintegration is important. Next consider where on the bike you put it. Laying on the ground with a dislocated shoulder, broken ribs, leg... and looking at the bike laying on the side where the kit is inside of the side opening cases you will think one thing only, I am an @55 hole. You cant flip the bike over with broken ribs and leg even after you manage to put the shoulder back in. The bike is on the side opening box with the first aid kit so anything you brought is useless. If you need survival, see below, you need to put those pretty side opening cases on a street bike where they belong and get some top opening or soft cases that can be cut open. I have now done this and am no longer that @55 hole! Just saying! OK, So down the rabbit hole we go, are you road riding where people will find you right away and get an ambulance or are you off road. In the road riding some basic stuff is nice but let the abulance get you to a doctor and save the weight. There are services available to cover everything your kit includes. Survival is not an issue since there are cars driving by. Serives are not an issue since someone will help and stores abound. In the local off road bit you need to decide how far out you are. If you need to be able to survive until your wife calls in a search because you missed lunch then you dont need all this. There are services available within 12 hours, probably much less. If you are smart someone rides with you or at least knows where you are. Services in an hour or two. Survival only for that long. If you stand a chance of having to get your self out or wait until those services arrive then survival can be an issue. In that schenario this kit is just about right. I noted some adjustments to consider below but your list sounds like a great kit. A night in the woods mean you need to deal with the broken leg, major cuts and bleeding, dislocated shoulder... If you are 4 miles into the woods with a broken leg, no cell phone coverage and some smashed ribs you are in trouble. Survival is until the services can get to you. That might include not freezing at night and some water to drink. You are no longer on a local ride. You are trying to stay alive so help can reach you. You dont need anti diarea stuff (also services), but you need to stop bleeding and stay put. 4 miles is forever with a broken leg and ribs. Trust me, it is a really long ways. long distance rides things get different. You have the survival thing but you also need the anti diarea and some others. Survival is an Issue and maybe for much longer and services might be non existent. I was glad to have a bottle of Doxycyclin with me in Peru. Some places in Alaska there will be nobody and no abulance for days. No Services. Your kit here must account for long term survival as well as lack of services. Broken legs, bleeding, dislocated shoulder and NOBODY is coming. When they do come you may go to a place with limited service so that imodium or other services based items will not be available. Survival is huge, Services are non existent. You are on your own. This is the big kit. bring everything and learn how to use it. Like I said, consider Survival and Services, then decide how much to carry. Every ride is different so if one kit is all you will do you must account for the majority of rides then add for the ocasional big ride. I have a kit that include sutures, used them once on me and once on a tire, eye irigation, Ace bandages and plaster rolls, rescue breether... It doent come out often and needs to be gone through every time because medical supplies have a shelf life. I ride sweep for our clubs ride, Trail, DS and Adventure rides The Birkshire Trail Riders and you should all come to one this summer. We find riders in all states and have to get them out BUT we only stabilize for transport, no services stuff and no survival stuff in the kit. I ride rallies like the Roaming Rally, 1000 miles of mixed Canadian wildernes and gravel roads but I ride with a team. Need is to stabilize for transport and be able to transport on a bike sometimes, but still no survival, no survices stuff. I have the full kit for when my kids have moved out and I get to go adventuring again, Africa wil likely be my next big one but that is years away. Skypilot, A.K.A. Chris Eckert in CT > From: fw189uhu > Sent: Saturday, February 2, 2013 11:16 PM > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com http://us.mc1847.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=DSN_KLR650%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? > > - Medications (travel size or sample packets), Anti-diarrhea, tylenol... All this is for long range stuff. Not emergencies > o Compact first aid book - read it before you go riding!!!!!!! This is the education thing someone mentioned!!! > o Emergency Mylar thermal blanket - this is important for a clean work area too. lay on the ground under the victims leg... > o Glow snap stick (emergency signaling) - the high intensity ones from major surplus are great but you need an led light too > o Large heavy duty Zip-Loc bag (trash removal) > - Instant cold pack (1) - good idea. I may add one to my rally kit > - Tourniquet (military style Combat Application Tourniquet) - good but a sling will do the same plus hold up an arm > - SAM splint 18" or air splint - I like the SAM but I carry two rolls of 4" casting plaster. mixed with sticks and on one side of a limb then wrap ace bandage around for emergency splint. can also use it to stabilize a foot, hand... In the McGyver category of saving lives this stuff is better than chewing gum and a paper clip > - Moleskin > - Chapstick - Mine has a tube of vasaline style lip stuff that works well to keeps cuts dry and clean too > - Saline vials (not sure about this; drinking water seems OK to me) - I use sealed disposable eye wash bottles that work as wound wash also > ************************************************************ This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, delete this communication and destroy all copies. ************************************************************ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Jeff Khoury]

//Leaving the scene of an accident.// I certainly hope you fought that one. -Jeff Khoury

----- Original Message ----- From: "mark ward" To: "DSN KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com>, "Christopher (CTO Service Delivery)Eckert" Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2013 11:24:49 AM Subject: RE: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? Middle of No-where. It was mentioned, Survival untill help comes, (If broken leg, ETC ETC.) And if OUT TO FAR it may be days. THATS where a Spot comes in, OUT OF CELL TOWER RANGE. And "No service" can even happen IN town, where hopefully someone will "spot" you. I was laying from waist up, 4 cracked ribs, on a "Popular" paved road, in the Ozarks, NO CELL coverage, & 90 miles from the hospital, and in the next 1.5hrs+- NO cars. I was lucky that time to be with someone who got my bike up so WE could ride to the hospital, (shifting by hand, engine gaurd blocked the shifter.) Got a ticket for $400.+ for leaving the sceen of the accident (Arkansaw S.police) I carry A LARGE kit. (1st aid AND tools, AND......) --- On Wed, 2/6/13, Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) chris.eckert@... > wrote: From: Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) chris.eckert@... > Subject: RE: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: "mark ward" nomad59@... >, DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 6:57 PM Go back to what I said. The Spot is a brilliant device but it is only one part of a service. If you are in the middle of the Trans Canadian Trail then having the spot tells people where you are and that you are in trouble. It doesnt mean there is anybody within a few hundred miles that will be able to respond quickly. It is a great service but you must still consider the availability of Services. All it does is let you call for help easier. It doesn't mean help is near. On the up side it makes for fabulous ride reports pictures From: mark ward [mailto: nomad59@... ] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 12:33 PM To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com ; Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? Hey Sky (Chris) 1st. Riding in the boonies, GET A SPOT, Besides Medical, you can track everywhere you go on Google maps. The "trouble" is/was, Those that have never been, or think they never will be, in any situation, to need help or to help others. Some people are natural Protectors, they keep an eye open at all times to Help others, it's there "way". (Mine) The 2 friends that "NEVER" need anything, also say.... I'm sure someone else will have it If I!!! need it. (in 3 yrs I can easly count 11 times between the 2, just when I was with them.) Aniti Diarea, Many deal with low blood sugar, even when not a Hypoglycemic (ME) or Diabetic, And you can eat all you want, But if diarea ETC. is acting up, YOU SUGARS WILL BE OUT OF WACK. Sometimes you do not know whats happening for Hours!! YOUR FOCUS AND MOOD, WILL BE OFF, when riding etc. Traveling, and strange water, even city water can be an issue. --- On Wed, 2/6/13, Skypilot chris.eckert@... > wrote: From: Skypilot chris.eckert@... > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 5:00 PM Digger and all, Now that I am catching up I am reading this over and would suggest a few things. This is a very important topic and I hope we can keep a focus on it without people getting all freaky. I think what is causing so many varried opinions on what to carry is that you have not properly defined the need. It is not local or long distance that differentiates. It is two things. survival vs services First two important points. A first aid kit for a bike needs to survive a lot. It must be kept safe and DRY. the contents must be kept from vibrating. All those canvas bagged kits dont work so put them in the car. I recomend going to someplace like Fuerte cases and buying a hardened plastic case for thisSomething like a seahorse or pelican case. They are very water proof and some compressible foam will stabilize everything inside. That said a large coffee can would do the trick if needed. Water proof is important. Not vibrating to the point of disintegration is important. Next consider where on the bike you put it. Laying on the ground with a dislocated shoulder, broken ribs, leg... and looking at the bike laying on the side where the kit is inside of the side opening cases you will think one thing only, I am an @55 hole. You cant flip the bike over with broken ribs and leg even after you manage to put the shoulder back in. The bike is on the side opening box with the first aid kit so anything you brought is useless. If you need survival, see below, you need to put those pretty side opening cases on a street bike where they belong and get some top opening or soft cases that can be cut open. I have now done this and am no longer that @55 hole! Just saying! OK, So down the rabbit hole we go, are you road riding where people will find you right away and get an ambulance or are you off road. In the road riding some basic stuff is nice but let the abulance get you to a doctor and save the weight. There are services available to cover everything your kit includes. Survival is not an issue since there are cars driving by. Serives are not an issue since someone will help and stores abound. In the local off road bit you need to decide how far out you are. If you need to be able to survive until your wife calls in a search because you missed lunch then you dont need all this. There are services available within 12 hours, probably much less. If you are smart someone rides with you or at least knows where you are. Services in an hour or two. Survival only for that long. If you stand a chance of having to get your self out or wait until those services arrive then survival can be an issue. In that schenario this kit is just about right. I noted some adjustments to consider below but your list sounds like a great kit. A night in the woods mean you need to deal with the broken leg, major cuts and bleeding, dislocated shoulder... If you are 4 miles into the woods with a broken leg, no cell phone coverage and some smashed ribs you are in trouble. Survival is until the services can get to you. That might include not freezing at night and some water to drink. You are no longer on a local ride. You are trying to stay alive so help can reach you. You dont need anti diarea stuff (also services), but you need to stop bleeding and stay put. 4 miles is forever with a broken leg and ribs. Trust me, it is a really long ways. long distance rides things get different. You have the survival thing but you also need the anti diarea and some others. Survival is an Issue and maybe for much longer and services might be non existent. I was glad to have a bottle of Doxycyclin with me in Peru. Some places in Alaska there will be nobody and no abulance for days. No Services. Your kit here must account for long term survival as well as lack of services. Broken legs, bleeding, dislocated shoulder and NOBODY is coming. When they do come you may go to a place with limited service so that imodium or other services based items will not be available. Survival is huge, Services are non existent. You are on your own. This is the big kit. bring everything and learn how to use it. Like I said, consider Survival and Services, then decide how much to carry. Every ride is different so if one kit is all you will do you must account for the majority of rides then add for the ocasional big ride. I have a kit that include sutures, used them once on me and once on a tire, eye irigation, Ace bandages and plaster rolls, rescue breether... It doent come out often and needs to be gone through every time because medical supplies have a shelf life. I ride sweep for our clubs ride, Trail, DS and Adventure rides The Birkshire Trail Riders and you should all come to one this summer. We find riders in all states and have to get them out BUT we only stabilize for transport, no services stuff and no survival stuff in the kit. I ride rallies like the Roaming Rally, 1000 miles of mixed Canadian wildernes and gravel roads but I ride with a team. Need is to stabilize for transport and be able to transport on a bike sometimes, but still no survival, no survices stuff. I have the full kit for when my kids have moved out and I get to go adventuring again, Africa wil likely be my next big one but that is years away. Skypilot, A.K.A. Chris Eckert in CT > From: fw189uhu > Sent: Saturday, February 2, 2013 11:16 PM > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com http://us.mc1847.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=DSN_KLR650%40yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? > > - Medications (travel size or sample packets), Anti-diarrhea, tylenol... All this is for long range stuff. Not emergencies > o Compact first aid book - read it before you go riding!!!!!!! This is the education thing someone mentioned!!! > o Emergency Mylar thermal blanket - this is important for a clean work area too. lay on the ground under the victims leg... > o Glow snap stick (emergency signaling) - the high intensity ones from major surplus are great but you need an led light too > o Large heavy duty Zip-Loc bag (trash removal) > - Instant cold pack (1) - good idea. I may add one to my rally kit > - Tourniquet (military style Combat Application Tourniquet) - good but a sling will do the same plus hold up an arm > - SAM splint 18" or air splint - I like the SAM but I carry two rolls of 4" casting plaster. mixed with sticks and on one side of a limb then wrap ace bandage around for emergency splint. can also use it to stabilize a foot, hand... In the McGyver category of saving lives this stuff is better than chewing gum and a paper clip > - Moleskin > - Chapstick - Mine has a tube of vasaline style lip stuff that works well to keeps cuts dry and clean too > - Saline vials (not sure about this; drinking water seems OK to me) - I use sealed disposable eye wash bottles that work as wound wash also > ************************************************************ This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, delete this communication and destroy all copies. ************************************************************ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[mark ward]

$400 for leaving the sceen $300. for "reckless driving" (caught Debris in the road, in a sharp wet curve) Paid $500. of it to a Arkansaw Laywer who said "It's Simple, They have NOTHING on you" and $200 for A "civil offence" (Like treaspassing?? No points Record clean) Pre asked His fee? His question, How much are the tickets? Can you say "Gang ra$$$"

--- On Wed, 2/6/13, Jeff Khoury wrote: From: Jeff Khoury Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: "mark ward" Cc: "DSN KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com>, "Christopher (CTO Service Delivery)Eckert" Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 7:27 PM //Leaving the scene of an accident.// I certainly hope you fought that one. -Jeff Khoury ----- Original Message ----- From: "mark ward" nomad59@...> To: "DSN KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com>, "Christopher (CTO Service Delivery)Eckert" chris.eckert@...> Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2013 11:24:49 AM Subject: RE: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? Middle of No-where. It was mentioned, Survival untill help comes, (If broken leg, ETC ETC.) And if OUT TO FAR it may be days. THATS where a Spot comes in, OUT OF CELL TOWER RANGE. And "No service" can even happen IN town, where hopefully someone will "spot" you. I was laying from waist up, 4 cracked ribs, on a "Popular" paved road, in the Ozarks, NO CELL coverage, & 90 miles from the hospital, and in the next 1.5hrs+- NO cars. I was lucky that time to be with someone who got my bike up so WE could ride to the hospital, (shifting by hand, engine gaurd blocked the shifter.) Got a ticket for $400.+ for leaving the sceen of the accident (Arkansaw S.police) I carry A LARGE kit. (1st aid AND tools, AND......) --- On Wed, 2/6/13, Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) chris.eckert@... > wrote: From: Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) chris.eckert@... > Subject: RE: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: "mark ward" nomad59@... >, DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 6:57 PM Go back to what I said. The Spot is a brilliant device but it is only one part of a service. If you are in the middle of the Trans Canadian Trail then having the spot tells people where you are and that you are in trouble. It doesnt mean there is anybody within a few hundred miles that will be able to respond quickly. It is a great service but you must still consider the availability of Services. All it does is let you call for help easier. It doesn't mean help is near. On the up side it makes for fabulous ride reports pictures From: mark ward [mailto: nomad59@... ] Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2013 12:33 PM To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com ; Eckert, Christopher (CTO Service Delivery) Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? Hey Sky (Chris) 1st. Riding in the boonies, GET A SPOT, Besides Medical, you can track everywhere you go on Google maps. The "trouble" is/was, Those that have never been, or think they never will be, in any situation, to need help or to help others. Some people are natural Protectors, they keep an eye open at all times to Help others, it's there "way". (Mine) The 2 friends that "NEVER" need anything, also say.... I'm sure someone else will have it If I!!! need it. (in 3 yrs I can easly count 11 times between the 2, just when I was with them.) Aniti Diarea, Many deal with low blood sugar, even when not a Hypoglycemic (ME) or Diabetic, And you can eat all you want, But if diarea ETC. is acting up, YOU SUGARS WILL BE OUT OF WACK. Sometimes you do not know whats happening for Hours!! YOUR FOCUS AND MOOD, WILL BE OFF, when riding etc. Traveling, and strange water, even city water can be an issue. --- On Wed, 2/6/13, Skypilot chris.eckert@... > wrote: From: Skypilot chris.eckert@... > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, February 6, 2013, 5:00 PM Digger and all, Now that I am catching up I am reading this over and would suggest a few things. This is a very important topic and I hope we can keep a focus on it without people getting all freaky. I think what is causing so many varried opinions on what to carry is that you have not properly defined the need. It is not local or long distance that differentiates. It is two things. survival vs services First two important points. A first aid kit for a bike needs to survive a lot. It must be kept safe and DRY. the contents must be kept from vibrating. All those canvas bagged kits dont work so put them in the car. I recomend going to someplace like Fuerte cases and buying a hardened plastic case for thisSomething like a seahorse or pelican case. They are very water proof and some compressible foam will stabilize everything inside. That said a large coffee can would do the trick if needed. Water proof is important. Not vibrating to the point of disintegration is important. Next consider where on the bike you put it. Laying on the ground with a dislocated shoulder, broken ribs, leg... and looking at the bike laying on the side where the kit is inside of the side opening cases you will think one thing only, I am an @55 hole. You cant flip the bike over with broken ribs and leg even after you manage to put the shoulder back in. The bike is on the side opening box with the first aid kit so anything you brought is useless. If you need survival, see below, you need to put those pretty side opening cases on a street bike where they belong and get some top opening or soft cases that can be cut open. I have now done this and am no longer that @55 hole! Just saying! OK, So down the rabbit hole we go, are you road riding where people will find you right away and get an ambulance or are you off road. In the road riding some basic stuff is nice but let the abulance get you to a doctor and save the weight. There are services available to cover everything your kit includes. Survival is not an issue since there are cars driving by. Serives are not an issue since someone will help and stores abound. In the local off road bit you need to decide how far out you are. If you need to be able to survive until your wife calls in a search because you missed lunch then you dont need all this. There are services available within 12 hours, probably much less. If you are smart someone rides with you or at least knows where you are. Services in an hour or two. Survival only for that long. If you stand a chance of having to get your self out or wait until those services arrive then survival can be an issue. In that schenario this kit is just about right. I noted some adjustments to consider below but your list sounds like a great kit. A night in the woods mean you need to deal with the broken leg, major cuts and bleeding, dislocated shoulder... If you are 4 miles into the woods with a broken leg, no cell phone coverage and some smashed ribs you are in trouble. Survival is until the services can get to you. That might include not freezing at night and some water to drink. You are no longer on a local ride. You are trying to stay alive so help can reach you. You dont need anti diarea stuff (also services), but you need to stop bleeding and stay put. 4 miles is forever with a broken leg and ribs. Trust me, it is a really long ways. long distance rides things get different. You have the survival thing but you also need the anti diarea and some others. Survival is an Issue and maybe for much longer and services might be non existent. I was glad to have a bottle of Doxycyclin with me in Peru. Some places in Alaska there will be nobody and no abulance for days. No Services. Your kit here must account for long term survival as well as lack of services. Broken legs, bleeding, dislocated shoulder and NOBODY is coming. When they do come you may go to a place with limited service so that imodium or other services based items will not be available. Survival is huge, Services are non existent. You are on your own. This is the big kit. bring everything and learn how to use it. Like I said, consider Survival and Services, then decide how much to carry. Every ride is different so if one kit is all you will do you must account for the majority of rides then add for the ocasional big ride. I have a kit that include sutures, used them once on me and once on a tire, eye irigation, Ace bandages and plaster rolls, rescue breether... It doent come out often and needs to be gone through every time because medical supplies have a shelf life. I ride sweep for our clubs ride, Trail, DS and Adventure rides The Birkshire Trail Riders and you should all come to one this summer. We find riders in all states and have to get them out BUT we only stabilize for transport, no services stuff and no survival stuff in the kit. I ride rallies like the Roaming Rally, 1000 miles of mixed Canadian wildernes and gravel roads but I ride with a team. Need is to stabilize for transport and be able to transport on a bike sometimes, but still no survival, no survices stuff. I have the full kit for when my kids have moved out and I get to go adventuring again, Africa wil likely be my next big one but that is years away. Skypilot, A.K.A. Chris Eckert in CT > From: fw189uhu > Sent: Saturday, February 2, 2013 11:16 PM > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com http://us.mc1847.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=DSN_KLR650%40yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? > > - Medications (travel size or sample packets), Anti-diarrhea, tylenol... All this is for long range stuff. Not emergencies > o Compact first aid book - read it before you go riding!!!!!!! This is the education thing someone mentioned!!! > o Emergency Mylar thermal blanket - this is important for a clean work area too. lay on the ground under the victims leg... > o Glow snap stick (emergency signaling) - the high intensity ones from major surplus are great but you need an led light too > o Large heavy duty Zip-Loc bag (trash removal) > - Instant cold pack (1) - good idea. I may add one to my rally kit > - Tourniquet (military style Combat Application Tourniquet) - good but a sling will do the same plus hold up an arm > - SAM splint 18" or air splint - I like the SAM but I carry two rolls of 4" casting plaster. mixed with sticks and on one side of a limb then wrap ace bandage around for emergency splint. can also use it to stabilize a foot, hand... In the McGyver category of saving lives this stuff is better than chewing gum and a paper clip > - Moleskin > - Chapstick - Mine has a tube of vasaline style lip stuff that works well to keeps cuts dry and clean too > - Saline vials (not sure about this; drinking water seems OK to me) - I use sealed disposable eye wash bottles that work as wound wash also > ************************************************************ This communication, including attachments, is for the exclusive use of addressee and may contain proprietary, confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, disclosure, dissemination or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, delete this communication and destroy all copies. ************************************************************ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Fred Hink]

Mark and the rest of List Members, Yes, these types of messages have become more frequent recently and easier to detect. I hope no one is clicking on those links. I don t think the links themselves will cause any problems but they originate from the problem. My advice is to just delete anything that looks suspicious. I removed the two messages yesterday evening from the list and have put the senders on moderated status. There is no risk to you or to this list if you just ignore these few odd messages. Thank you Mark for taking out the offending link and not replying with the offender intact. This makes my job of cleaning up messes easier. I m not sure how these types of messages are generated but I would advise everyone to have a good antivirus program running on their computer at all times with the latest updates and do not click on any links that look suspicious. It is fairly easy to spot the good links from the bad ones. Just be aware. This is true for this list and any other place on the internet. And one last comment about NKLR messages. Mark if you want to post something to the list that isn t KLR related, the reason we use NKLR in the subject line is so that anyone that doesn t want to have to read anything not related to the KLR can set filters to stop those types of messages. Using anything other than NKLR for those types of messages does nothing for those that want to use that filter. So I say again, if you think your comments are not related to the KLR please use only NKLR in the subject line. OK, that being said one last clarification about this message in particular. If you have a message not KLR related but is important for the whole list to read (like this message) then using the NKLR in the subject line is probably best not used since not all the list will receive your message. This isn t a big issue but just trying to make clear how this list works and what we all can do to help everyone else have a better experience here. If anyone has feelings for or against using NKLR as one of our list rules, please let me know. I can leave it as is or remove it and make my job much easier. This makes no difference to me but it s up to you. Back to your regularly scheduled programming...... Fred List Admin. From: mark ward Sent: Saturday, February 9, 2013 6:24 AM To: List KLR Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Bad Email Notice,...Subject "welcome to". (non bike) NOTICE The "wecome to" in the subject line, Emails, look like ANOUTHER one to avoid. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[revmaaatin]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "Fred Hink" wrote: SNIP> I still travel light on long rides and won t have 90% of your list with me. Part of an adventure is dealing with events as they happen. Trying to prevent all events would take away most of the fun of a trip for me. > > YMMV > > Fred > http://www.arrowheadmotorsports.com Fine is the line between adventure and adverstity. smile. In a recent layover in Houston to Managua, my son needed tylenol; $5 for 4 tablets. It was more than just an adventure, it was a protoligist exam. yeah, cough. revmaaatin. yes, I paid the money. I asked to be kissed and the clerk looked at me funny.... revmaaatin.

[revmaaatin]

Be sure to pack your pills 'tight' with a cotton ball or rag. Otherwise, they will turn to dust from be jiggled around. Aspirin (white pills) is especially susceptible to this malady. Tylenol tablets (also of the white variety) somewhat fragile. Coated pills, no so much. No knowledge what the KLR does/will do to 'blue pills'. We could ask some of the harley riders. shrug. revmaaatin.

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, mark ward wrote: > > ALWAYS? Tylenol (as fred said) AND Anti diarea pills, in a small AM/PM pill case $2. > > --- On Sun, 2/3/13, Fred Hink wrote: > > > From: Fred Hink > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "fw189uhu" > Date: Sunday, February 3, 2013, 3:54 PM > > > > > > > > I try to pack light for local riding, since I am familiar with the terrain here, I know pretty much what to expect. I only carry the bare essentials, like water, food (snacks) and a coat or light jacket depending on the weather. Since I am fair skinned and I live in a desert, in the summer I also carry sunscreen. I always have Tylenol (acetaminophen) with me no matter what I am doing. Other than that, I would leave all the rest of your list at home. We all travel differently for different reasons and need different things to be able to do this. Local rides I believe in packing light and carry my wits about me. This will save you more than all the medicine in the world. > > On long rides away from my local area, then there are different needs and I pack accordingly. I still travel light on long rides and won t have 90% of your list with me. Part of an adventure is dealing with events as they happen. Trying to prevent all events would take away most of the fun of a trip for me. > > YMMV > > Fred > http://www.arrowheadmotorsports.com > > From: fw189uhu > Sent: Saturday, February 2, 2013 11:16 PM > To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? > > I'm putting together a comprehensive first aid kit for local (not long-distance) riding since the military IFAKs I usually carry are not really specialized for motorcycling (for example, I don't really expect to get shot while riding around the home area). Couldn't find much specifically about this subject previously posted on this group. > > My goal is to obtain a non-huge first aid kit that will cover the most common local ride medical problems. Obviously a long-distance kit will have more contents and quantities, but that's a discussion for another day. > > What do you carry? I put together this list with an eye towards keeping the pouch size relatively small. If the kit will fit into a standard military IFAK pouch, all the better. I left "cell phone" and "water" off the list, but they're obviously important emergency items. > > What off-the-shelf kit can you recommend as a starting place? > > - Medications (travel size or sample packets) > o Anti-diarrhea tablets > o Anti-acid tablets (if you need them) > o Antihistamine tablets > o Aspirin (325 mg) > o Tylenol (for those who can't take aspirin) > o Motrin 500 (Ranger Candy) > o Preparation H (if you need it; thank God I don't) > o Emergency prescription meds > o Antiseptic/Betadine wipes (3 packets) > o Antibiotic ointment (3 packets) > o Antimicrobial hand cleaner (small bottle or 4 packets) > o Burn cream or jel/aloe vera > o Eye drops > - Bandages > o Triangular bandage (do-rag) > o Ace bandage > o Band-aids (various sizes) > o Knuckle & fingertip band-aids (2 each) > o Large 2x4 or 4x4 band-aids (2) > o Steri-Strips (butterfly sutures) (4) > o Cohesive wrap 2"x75' > o Large sterile gauze pads (6) > - Gear > o Trauma shears, heavy-duty (EMT shears) > o Tweezers > o Irrigation syringe > o Large safety pins > o Latex gloves (2 pr) > o Q-tips > o CPR mask > o Compact first aid book > o Emergency Mylar thermal blanket > o Glow snap stick (emergency signaling) > o Large heavy duty Zip-Loc bag (trash removal) > o 4x4 gauze pads (3) > o 4x4 Telfa pads (no-stick) > o Small compression bandage (military) > o 1" paper surgical tape (30') > - Instant cold pack (1) > - Tourniquet (military style Combat Application Tourniquet) > - SAM splint 18" or air splint > - Moleskin > - Sunburn lotion > - Chapstick > - Electrolyte mix > - Saline vials (not sure about this; drinking water seems OK to me) > > Most of this stuff is fairly small in the quantities indicated, but is more than will fit into a standard IFAK pouch. Of course the CAT tourniquet comes in its own separate pouch. > > I like the idea of including oral airways, but multiple sizes are needed and I'm not sure they're worth the space. > > What do you take? TIA. > > Digger > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

[revmaaatin]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, RobertWichert wrote:

> > Butterfly sutures are a great idea. Very useful.

SNIP

> Lots of big Adhesive Bandages is a good idea. I carry those.

One can 'manufacture' a butterfly suture from adhesive tape; or even from the big adhesive bandage you are carrying. Cut the tape to length = 2-3 inches Cut out the center part to 1/2 the width of the tape ie the butterfly that will cross the wound site. Use a match/lighter to burn off the adhesive of the narrow section of the butterfly. It will look like this: ---\__/--- __ ---/ \---- Did I miss including super glue in the McGiver first aid kit? revmaaatin.

[RobertWichert]

I have done this before, without the flame. It worked great and stopped the bleeding. She still says her finger is numb where it was cut, but I didn't cut it, I just patched it up, so I'm not feeling too guilty. Robert Wichert P.Eng. LEED AP BD&C +1 916 966 9060 FAX +1 916 966 9068 ===============================================

On 2/9/2013 9:30 PM, revmaaatin wrote: > > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > , RobertWichert wrote: > > > > Butterfly sutures are a great idea. Very useful. > SNIP > > Lots of big Adhesive Bandages is a good idea. I carry those. > > One can 'manufacture' a butterfly suture from adhesive tape; or even > from the big adhesive bandage you are carrying. > > Cut the tape to length = 2-3 inches > Cut out the center part to 1/2 the width of the tape ie the butterfly > that will cross the wound site. > > Use a match/lighter to burn off the adhesive of the narrow section of > the butterfly. > > It will look like this: > > ---\__/--- > __ > ---/ \---- > > Did I miss including super glue in the McGiver first aid kit? > > revmaaatin. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[mark ward]

Survival, Thats #1. And Surviving a situation is about....KNOWLEDGE!!!!!! more then gear. While Lots of gear is nice when needed, What to do with it or......What ever to get the job done, KNOWLEDGE is whats needed most. What kind of water to flush a gash?? The U.S. Navy taught us, PEE is more "Sanitary" then most standing water. (ponds lakes etc.) Not that it should/would, NOT, ever be your first choice, above clean drinking water etc., Urine, is Just alot better then many other "choice's" you may have, in a "suvival" situation. "Survival" can be hr's or days, But I refer to it also as LONG TERM EFFECT'S. (scars, Infections, LEG LOST, ETC.)

--- On Sun, 2/10/13, RobertWichert wrote: From: RobertWichert Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Local Riding First Aid Kit Contents? To: "revmaaatin" Cc: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, February 10, 2013, 5:04 PM I have done this before, without the flame. It worked great and stopped the bleeding. She still says her finger is numb where it was cut, but I didn't cut it, I just patched it up, so I'm not feeling too guilty. Robert Wichert P.Eng. LEED AP BD&C +1 916 966 9060 FAX +1 916 966 9068 =============================================== On 2/9/2013 9:30 PM, revmaaatin wrote: > > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > , RobertWichert wrote: > > > > Butterfly sutures are a great idea. Very useful. > SNIP > > Lots of big Adhesive Bandages is a good idea. I carry those. > > One can 'manufacture' a butterfly suture from adhesive tape; or even > from the big adhesive bandage you are carrying. > > Cut the tape to length = 2-3 inches > Cut out the center part to 1/2 the width of the tape ie the butterfly > that will cross the wound site. > > Use a match/lighter to burn off the adhesive of the narrow section of > the butterfly. > > It will look like this: > > ---\__/--- > __ > ---/ \---- > > Did I miss including super glue in the McGiver first aid kit? > > revmaaatin. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]