Wilsons Sandbox

Posted: **Tue Dec 28, 1999 11:40 am**

Hello everyone

I am continuing to work on getting my xpeg 1500 engine into my TC and
getting very close. One issue has come up that I could use some help on. I
was planning on using a TF starter and 8" clutch but discovered that my TC
bell housing makes contact with the clutch. When I turn the the crank over
by hand I can here a slight scraping sound. I looked at a TF bell housing
and I see the clutch shaft is recessed deeper into the bell housing. It is
also a 3/4" diameter where the TC shaft is 5/8".

Here are the problems as I see them

In order to use the TF bell housing ( with a 3/4" shaft) I need to change
the clutch lever to a TC style, which is designed to fit 5/8" shaft. Do I
need to pull the TF 3/4" shaft and turn the end to fit the TC lever?

The TF bell housing has a different register where it mates up to the gear
box. I assume I would machine that off and just have a flat face and rely
on the bolts alone. Is this correct??

Is there some way to modify the TC bell housing to fit the 8" clutch??

Or should I just use the 7.250" clutch?

Any help or advice would be much appreciated. I know several of you have
the 1500 in a TC. What did you do and why?

Thanks!!!!

Bob

TC 7388 EXU

Posted: **Tue Dec 28, 1999 3:51 pm**

Bob,

I did this once, way back, and hit the same problem as you. I simply put three
large flat washers on each bolt between the bell housing and the engine thus
moving the engine forwards by 3/16 inch so the cover plate missed the release
shaft boss.

Nowadays, especially if I had my own machining capability, I would probably make
an aluminum spacer to go between engine and bell housing.

> In order to use the TF bell housing ( with a 3/4" shaft) I need to change
> the clutch lever to a TC style, which is designed to fit 5/8" shaft. Do I
> need to pull the TF 3/4" shaft and turn the end to fit the TC lever?

Not a bad idea. You could also bore out the actuator lever to 3/4" but that
would be more difficult to return to standard than fitting a new shaft back in
the TF b/h.

> The TF bell housing has a different register where it mates up to the gear
> box. I assume I would machine that off and just have a flat face and rely
> on the bolts alone. Is this correct??

I think this is a BAD idea. The register is there to centrally locate the
gearbox first motion shaft bearing and just the bolts would not ensure that.
Compare to the pins between engine and bell housing. My spare gearboxes have
the bell housings on them, but I seem to remember the gearbox bearing stands
proud and fits into the recess in the bell housing to ensure the correct end
float. The TD/TF gearbox had a smaller gearbox bearing

You could make an adapter plate to go between gearbox and bell housing.

> Or should I just use the 7.250" clutch?

I've been racing a fairly powerful 1466cc engine on a standard 7 1/4" clutch for
the last 3 seasons and upon recent disassembly (It was a semi automatic
disassembly) could not see any signs of overheating. I could have done with
more bite on aggressive hill climb starts and I only occasionally felt it might
be slipping in 4th when pulling hard up hills.

If all you are doing is fitting an XPEG with no power enhancement, then a 7 1/4"
clutch will suffice, in my opinion. Isn't the TF heavier than TC?

Bob Grunau talks of a Ford Escort clutch being fittable to TC flywheel so expect
to hear something from him.

Good luck
Peter,
TC8892

Posted: **Wed Dec 29, 1999 6:17 am**

Hi Bob
I have more info at home but the way to do it is to take your TF
flywheel, and have it turned down so that it will take the ring gear
that is used on the TC, of course you have to use the TC starter
also, then you have to have the flywheel turned down on the clutch
surface, it seems to me you need to take off about 5/16", I can
check on this later, you then use the clutch plate and clutch use on
a late TD, TF and/or I think early MGA, make sure you have enought
clearance and you are all set, like he said, if the engine is not tuned,
the standard clutch should be okay.
Cheers Dean
-----Original Message-----
From: bgthomas@earthlink.net
To: mg-tabc@egroups.com
Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 1:44 PM
Subject: [mg-tabc] How can I put an 8" clutch in a TC

>
>Hello everyone
>
>I am continuing to work on getting my xpeg 1500 engine into my TC and
>getting very close. One issue has come up that I could use some help on.

I

>was planning on using a TF starter and 8" clutch but discovered that my TC
>bell housing makes contact with the clutch. When I turn the the crank over
>by hand I can here a slight scraping sound. I looked at a TF bell housing
>and I see the clutch shaft is recessed deeper into the bell housing. It is
>also a 3/4" diameter where the TC shaft is 5/8".
>
>Here are the problems as I see them
>
> In order to use the TF bell housing ( with a 3/4" shaft) I need to

change

>the clutch lever to a TC style, which is designed to fit 5/8" shaft. Do I
>need to pull the TF 3/4" shaft and turn the end to fit the TC lever?
>
>The TF bell housing has a different register where it mates up to the gear
>box. I assume I would machine that off and just have a flat face and rely
>on the bolts alone. Is this correct??
>
>Is there some way to modify the TC bell housing to fit the 8" clutch??
>
>Or should I just use the 7.250" clutch?
>
>Any help or advice would be much appreciated. I know several of you have
>the 1500 in a TC. What did you do and why?
>
>Thanks!!!!
>
>Bob
>
>TC 7388 EXU
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU!
>Gator fills in forms and remembers passwords with NO TYPING at over
>100,000 web sites! Get $100 in coupons for trying Gator!
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>
>
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>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
>
>
>

Posted: **Wed Dec 29, 1999 11:44 pm**

My TC9507 uses Ford 7.5" diaphragm clutch with no problems with 100 hp XPEG.
If using 8" clutch the MGB diaphragm clutch is said to be better than MGA
spring type.

" To fit XPEG with 8" clutch to TC gearbox the cross shaft must be ground
down on the side nearest the pressure plate to a depth of about 3/16 " for
about four inches on either side of the carbon thrust throw-out ring. The
other points of interference are the cross shaft bosses. Bevel these on the
inside forward sections. "
Richard Townley
TC9507
----------

>From: "Dean Jensen"
>To:
>Subject: [mg-tabc] Re: How can I put an 8" clutch in a TC
>Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 1:22
>

> Hi Bob
> I have more info at home but the way to do it is to take your TF
> flywheel, and have it turned down so that it will take the ring gear
> that is used on the TC, of course you have to use the TC starter
> also, then you have to have the flywheel turned down on the clutch
> surface, it seems to me you need to take off about 5/16", I can
> check on this later, you then use the clutch plate and clutch use on
> a late TD, TF and/or I think early MGA, make sure you have enought
> clearance and you are all set, like he said, if the engine is not tuned,
> the standard clutch should be okay.
> Cheers Dean
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bgthomas@earthlink.net
> To: mg-tabc@egroups.com
> Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 1:44 PM
> Subject: [mg-tabc] How can I put an 8" clutch in a TC
>
>
>>
>>Hello everyone
>>
>>I am continuing to work on getting my xpeg 1500 engine into my TC and
>>getting very close. One issue has come up that I could use some help on.
> I
>>was planning on using a TF starter and 8" clutch but discovered that my TC
>>bell housing makes contact with the clutch. When I turn the the crank over
>>by hand I can here a slight scraping sound. I looked at a TF bell housing
>>and I see the clutch shaft is recessed deeper into the bell housing. It is
>>also a 3/4" diameter where the TC shaft is 5/8".
>>
>>Here are the problems as I see them
>>
>> In order to use the TF bell housing ( with a 3/4" shaft) I need to
> change
>>the clutch lever to a TC style, which is designed to fit 5/8" shaft. Do I
>>need to pull the TF 3/4" shaft and turn the end to fit the TC lever?
>>
>>The TF bell housing has a different register where it mates up to the gear
>>box. I assume I would machine that off and just have a flat face and rely
>>on the bolts alone. Is this correct??
>>
>>Is there some way to modify the TC bell housing to fit the 8" clutch??
>>
>>Or should I just use the 7.250" clutch?
>>
>>Any help or advice would be much appreciated. I know several of you have
>>the 1500 in a TC. What did you do and why?
>>
>>Thanks!!!!
>>
>>Bob
>>
>>TC 7388 EXU
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU!
>>Gator fills in forms and remembers passwords with NO TYPING at over
>>100,000 web sites! Get $100 in coupons for trying Gator!
>>http://click.egroups.com/1/340/0/_/60353/_/946410262
>>
>>
>>eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/mg-tabc
>>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Posted: **Thu Dec 30, 1999 12:42 am**

BOB

I RUN AN XPEG WITH THE TC CLUTCH AND HAVE HAD NO PROBLEMS.
BEFORE I INSTALLED THE XPEG I WAS RUNNING THE XPAG WITH A SHORROCK
SUPERCHARGER LIKEWISE WITH NO PROBLEMS.
I JUST WENT THE EASY ROUTE AND USED THE TC FLYWHEEL AND STARTER.

IF I WERE TO GO AND CHANGE THINGS I WOULD LOOK INTO CONVERTING TO A DIAPHRAGM
CLUTCH IN THE 7 1/2" TO 8" RANGE. I USE A NISSAN CLUTCH BEHIND THE 1275 IN
MY MORRIS MINOR AND NO SLIPPAGE YET LIGHTER PEDAL.

MIKE

Posted: **Thu Dec 30, 1999 2:57 am**

Bob:

Just grind the bosses inside the bell housing, and when you get clearence,
all will work fine. I have done it several times. I believe its spelled out
in either the stage tune manual, or Woody Woods book.

Cheers:

Skip................

At 11:44 AM 12/28/99 -0800, bgthomas@earthlink.net wrote:

>
>Hello everyone
>
>I am continuing to work on getting my xpeg 1500 engine into my TC and
>getting very close. One issue has come up that I could use some help on. I
>was planning on using a TF starter and 8" clutch but discovered that my TC
>bell housing makes contact with the clutch. When I turn the the crank over
>by hand I can here a slight scraping sound. I looked at a TF bell housing
>and I see the clutch shaft is recessed deeper into the bell housing. It is
>also a 3/4" diameter where the TC shaft is 5/8".
>
>Here are the problems as I see them
>
> In order to use the TF bell housing ( with a 3/4" shaft) I need to change
>the clutch lever to a TC style, which is designed to fit 5/8" shaft. Do I
>need to pull the TF 3/4" shaft and turn the end to fit the TC lever?
>
>The TF bell housing has a different register where it mates up to the gear
>box. I assume I would machine that off and just have a flat face and rely
>on the bolts alone. Is this correct??
>
>Is there some way to modify the TC bell housing to fit the 8" clutch??
>
>Or should I just use the 7.250" clutch?
>
>Any help or advice would be much appreciated. I know several of you have
>the 1500 in a TC. What did you do and why?
>
>Thanks!!!!
>
>Bob
>
>TC 7388 EXU
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU!
>Gator fills in forms and remembers passwords with NO TYPING at over
>100,000 web sites! Get $100 in coupons for trying Gator!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/340/0/_/60353/_/946410262
>
>
>eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/mg-tabc
>http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
>
>
>
>
>
>

Posted: **Sat Jan 01, 2000 7:40 am**

Hi Bob

Getting back to you on the clutch, I see that you have plenty of
replyes. To expand on what I wrote, it is about 5/16 that needs to
be removed, it is not any exact amount, but 5/16 worked okay for
me. Thinking about it more I am not sure a TC starter will bolt
up to a TF engine, if it does this is the way to go, I think. If not
you would have to use the ring gear from an early TD flywheel,
instead of the TC ring gear. If you go this way (TC), which I have done
you only need two cuts on the fly wheel, you do not have to do
alot of redrilling and retaping, all parts can be obtained from you
MG supplier, not knowing what you have, you may need only the
ring gear.
I would not grind on the TC bell housing unless cost is the most
most important consideration, as the bell housing is already
weak, and is subject to breaking, as I can a attest to. The total
weight of the flywheel will still be about the same, and this will
have little effect, if any it will be positive. I believe another
consideration, is what gear box you are using, If you are using
a TC, you almost have to use the TC bell housing.
In closing, I change mine, I had no problem doing it, and I have
not had any problems since, it was easy to do.

Cheers Dean