Wilsons Sandbox

TA specials called Q-types are in my opinion, worthless !#Clive

On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 at 16:40, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u] A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

Hi Clive, Worthless may be a bit harsh but I am pretty sure that there will be a thriving industry in a few years time converting TQK s etc back to standard, whatever that is and probably by the same firms who did the Q-ing in the first place.  However it is a free world so you pays your money and makes your choice . To be fair I think some conversions look good and are well engineered. It s odd that we are enthusiastic about a period special but not so keen on the current batch.  Thanks to Jean for raising the issue.  Regards  Jeff TB0489 Currently in very smoky Australia  Sent from my iPhone

On 12 Nov 2019, at 05:02, CLIVE SHERRIFF csherriff99@gmail.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

   TA specials called Q-types  are in my opinion,  worthless ! # Clive  On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 at 16:40, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote: [u][/u]   A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

I don't think the price was a reflection of TB prices more to do with the history. The car had been owned by a renowned racing driver who competed in it in the Mille Miglia three times, the Targa Florio and the Gran Premio Nuvolari!

On Monday, 11 November 2019, 17:40:31 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

I may be offering my TB for sale in the coming months and am keenly interested in what they might bring. My car is restored as a race car, but I have the original swept wings and running boards if anyone would want to convert it back stock. It has larger 1500 valves in it and larger 1 1/2 SU s. Any ideas what it may bring?  A few years ago the appraiser from Hagerty thought the $80,000 range - but I don t know if that is accurate or not. I also have chrome wheels and chrome grill, however I have original painted wheels in good shape and also a new I painted grill.  [img]cid:23E4979F-31C8-4BB9-A14C-4F8D64A74CC9[/img] S[img]cid:5BE2BAC9-F5A7-4FF1-848E-9C3E3E92E8E8[/img]ent from my iPhone

On Nov 11, 2019, at 2:56 PM, Mike Inglehearn mingle54@btinternet.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  I don't think the price was a reflection of TB prices more to do with the history. The car had been owned by a renowned racing driver who competed in it in the Mille Miglia three times, the Targa Florio and the Gran Premio Nuvolari!

On Monday, 11 November 2019, 17:40:31 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

Jeff, Steve Gilbert fabricates fabulous cycle wings! Just received front and rears for my MG J2  I am restoring. Steve Gilbert - 01784466488 - sgilbert@emumail.net Unit 2 Devils  LaneEghamEngjandTW20 8HDUnited Kingdom Cheers,Jack KahlerChairman MG North AmericanMMM Register5260 South Zinnia CourtLittleton, Colorado 80127nammmr.org Sent from my iPad

On Nov 11, 2019, at 8:26 PM, Victor Savelli vic.savelli@sbcglobal.net [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  My cycle wings came from Barry Walker a number of years ago. They were from the original Abington jigs.  Sent from my iPhone On Nov 11, 2019, at 8:06 PM, jeffrey townsend jeff.townsend@hotmail.co.uk> wrote: Hi Vic, Your car looks great. The colour is similar to my TB. Photo below: I m not sure on prices but in the UK I think 50000to 60000 is maybe about right but a lot depends on quality, originality and history.  Do you know where the rear wings on your car were made? I m building a TA and have front cycle wings but not rears.  Regards  Jeff  Sent from my iPhone On 12 Nov 2019, at 09:07, Victor Savelli vic.savelli@sbcglobal.net [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I may be offering my TB for sale in the coming months and am keenly interested in what they might bring. My car is restored as a race car, but I have the original swept wings and running boards if anyone would want to convert it back stock. It has larger 1500 valves in it and larger 1 1/2 SU s. Any ideas what it may bring?  A few years ago the appraiser from Hagerty thought the $80,000 range - but I don t know if that is accurate or not. I also have chrome wheels and chrome grill, however I have original painted wheels in good shape and also a new I painted grill.  Sent from my iPhone On Nov 11, 2019, at 2:56 PM, Mike Inglehearn mingle54@btinternet.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   I don't think the price was a reflection of TB prices more to do with the history. The car had been owned by a renowned racing driver who competed in it in the Mille Miglia three times, the Targa Florio and the Gran Premio Nuvolari!

On Monday, 11 November 2019, 17:40:31 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

Further to my last, the engine is tuned and has larger carbs though the original carbs were included in the sale and the car currently has the FIA passport for international competitions, all in all NOT a normal TB.As Jeff has said for an immaculate and original car with matching numbers, 50-60,000 is probably about the right price, however competition history and / or a distinguished past owner can make a big difference!

On Monday, 11 November 2019, 21:56:44 CET, Mike Inglehearn mingle54@btinternet.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  I don't think the price was a reflection of TB prices more to do with the history. The car had been owned by a renowned racing driver who competed in it in the Mille Miglia three times, the Targa Florio and the Gran Premio Nuvolari!

On Monday, 11 November 2019, 17:40:31 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

If the TB had competed in the Mille Miglia in period, 1939, 40, ... I d agree it is an historic car with a greater value than a standard one but it did not. It competed only in what I d call Revivals, I don t know how what great name  they call them with but, in my humble opinion, it only means the owner is rich. This said, it is probably better to buy a car from a rich owner than from an impecunious one! [b]From:[/b] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com [b]Sent:[/b] Monday, November 11, 2019 9:56 PM [b]To:[/b] mg-tabc@yahoogroups.com ; jeanvignau@orange.fr [b]Subject:[/b] Re: [mg-tabc] TB prices     I don't think the price was a reflection of TB prices more to do with the history. The car had been owned by a renowned racing driver who competed in it in the Mille Miglia three times, the Targa Florio and the Gran Premio Nuvolari!               On Monday, 11 November 2019, 17:40:31 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:       A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

The TB never competed in the Mille Miglia, but qualifies because though it did not race one was entered on at least one occasion.Whilst the car may not be a specific "historic car", it does have a history of racing in "historic races", and no matter how you feel about it, it does make a difference to the value as does a distinguished owner.I think many would not consider the Mille Miglia to be merely a "revival"!

On Wednesday, 13 November 2019, 11:00:07 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  If the TB had competed in the Mille Miglia in period, 1939, 40, ... I d agree it is an historic car with a greater value than a standard one but it did not. It competed only in what I d call Revivals, I don t know how what great name  they call them with but, in my humble opinion, it only means the owner is rich. This said, it is probably better to buy a car from a rich owner than from an impecunious one! [b]From:[/b] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com [b]Sent:[/b] Monday, November 11, 2019 9:56 PM [b]To:[/b] mg-tabc@yahoogroups.com ; jeanvignau@orange.fr [b]Subject:[/b] Re: [mg-tabc] TB prices     I don't think the price was a reflection of TB prices more to do with the history. The car had been owned by a renowned racing driver who competed in it in the Mille Miglia three times, the Targa Florio and the Gran Premio Nuvolari!    

          On Monday, 11 November 2019, 17:40:31 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:       A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?

Sometime between 1947 - 1949 an "unidentified" MG over 1100cc competed in the Mille Miglia.   https://1000miglia.it/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Tabella_Coefficienti_Coefficients_List_22102018-1.pdf

On Wednesday, November 13, 2019, 10:41:47 PM PST, Mike Inglehearn mingle54@btinternet.com [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

  The TB never competed in the Mille Miglia, but qualifies because though it did not race one was entered on at least one occasion.Whilst the car may not be a specific "historic car", it does have a history of racing in "historic races", and no matter how you feel about it, it does make a difference to the value as does a distinguished owner.I think many would not consider the Mille Miglia to be merely a "revival"! On Wednesday, 13 November 2019, 11:00:07 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:   If the TB had competed in the Mille Miglia in period, 1939, 40, ... I d agree it is an historic car with a greater value than a standard one but it did not. It competed only in what I d call Revivals, I don t know how what great name  they call them with but, in my humble opinion, it only means the owner is rich. This said, it is probably better to buy a car from a rich owner than from an impecunious one! [b]From:[/b] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com [b]Sent:[/b] Monday, November 11, 2019 9:56 PM [b]To:[/b] mg-tabc@yahoogroups.com ; jeanvignau@orange.fr [b]Subject:[/b] Re: [mg-tabc] TB prices     I don't think the price was a reflection of TB prices more to do with the history. The car had been owned by a renowned racing driver who competed in it in the Mille Miglia three times, the Targa Florio and the Gran Premio Nuvolari!    

          On Monday, 11 November 2019, 17:40:31 CET, 'Jean Vignau' jeanvignau@orange.fr [mg-tabc] mg-tabc-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:       A TB was auctionned, on the25th of september 2019, 108,724 by Padova Finarte, so there were at least 2 would be bidders. It was within its estimated value of, if I remember well, 85/115,000 . You can see it on their website, finarte.it and then automobili da collezionz-Finarte. It was very clean looking, said to be prepared for events such as the Mille Miglia, Targa Florio (or Pebble Beach)! The only pre-war 4-cylinders MGs eligible for such events are the PB and TB. The radiator grille should not be black, the seats are non original, nor are the headlights, fog light or air filters. The engine looks standard. A new trend ? Any other example ? The end of TBs being paid less than the TA specials called Q-types ?