**sold**- one pair of bmw summer 2 nylon riding pants in tan, size m

[JWF]

Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I pressed Start and got this: Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. Sometimes a single click. Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes they go off the first time I push the button. Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts right up. Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. ONE: what's wrong? TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep starting once in while, while I work on it? Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF

[RobertWichert]

Probably bad connection somewhere. I'd start at the battery terminals. Could be bad connection INSIDE the battery (shorted or disconnected cells). Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP +1 916 966 9060 FAX +1 916 966 9068 ===============================================

On 8/8/2011 8:33 AM, JWF wrote: > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive > shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any > electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I > pressed Start and got this: > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > Sometimes a single click. > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left > hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes > all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes > they go off the first time I push the button. > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts > right up. > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > ONE: what's wrong? > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep > starting once in while, while I work on it? > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[JWF]

Robert, would the Battery Tender show the battery as fully charged if it was internally damaged? -JWF

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, RobertWichert wrote: > > Probably bad connection somewhere. I'd start at the battery terminals. > Could be bad connection INSIDE the battery (shorted or disconnected cells). > > > Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP > +1 916 966 9060 > FAX +1 916 966 9068 > > > > > > > > > > > > =============================================== > > > On 8/8/2011 8:33 AM, JWF wrote: > > > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive > > shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any > > electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I > > pressed Start and got this: > > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > > Sometimes a single click. > > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left > > hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes > > all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes > > they go off the first time I push the button. > > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts > > right up. > > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > > ONE: what's wrong? > > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep > > starting once in while, while I work on it? > > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

[Jeff Khoury]

I'm not Robert, but I'll try to answer: probably not. I test batteries like so: Inspect/Check/Tighten all connectors on the battery, solenoid and ground. Check fluid levels in battery (if required) Charge it on a slow rate overnight. Take off the charger and let it "rest" for an hour or so. Check the voltage with a meter (key off). Look for 11.8v or more. Turn the key on, watch the battery voltage while cranking. If the voltage drops below 10v while cranking, you have a bad battery. Leave it off the tender/charger and try again the next day to see if the battery will hold the charge. It's always worked for me.

----- Original Message ----- From: "JWF" To: "DSN KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2011 3:35:43 PM Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Start Button Intermittent Robert, would the Battery Tender show the battery as fully charged if it was internally damaged? -JWF --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com , RobertWichert wrote: > > Probably bad connection somewhere. I'd start at the battery terminals. > Could be bad connection INSIDE the battery (shorted or disconnected cells). > > > Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP > +1 916 966 9060 > FAX +1 916 966 9068 > > > > > > > > > > > > =============================================== > > > On 8/8/2011 8:33 AM, JWF wrote: > > > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive > > shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any > > electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I > > pressed Start and got this: > > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > > Sometimes a single click. > > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left > > hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes > > all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes > > they go off the first time I push the button. > > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts > > right up. > > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > > ONE: what's wrong? > > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep > > starting once in while, while I work on it? > > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

[JWF]

OK Jeff, I'll try it, thanks!

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Khoury wrote: > > I'm not Robert, but I'll try to answer: probably not. > > I test batteries like so: > > Inspect/Check/Tighten all connectors on the battery, solenoid and ground. > > Check fluid levels in battery (if required) > > Charge it on a slow rate overnight. > > Take off the charger and let it "rest" for an hour or so. > > Check the voltage with a meter (key off). Look for 11.8v or more. > > Turn the key on, watch the battery voltage while cranking. If the voltage drops below 10v while cranking, you have a bad battery. > > Leave it off the tender/charger and try again the next day to see if the battery will hold the charge. > > It's always worked for me. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JWF" > To: "DSN KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2011 3:35:43 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Start Button Intermittent > > > > > > > Robert, would the Battery Tender show the battery as fully charged if it was internally damaged? -JWF > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com , RobertWichert wrote: > > > > Probably bad connection somewhere. I'd start at the battery terminals. > > Could be bad connection INSIDE the battery (shorted or disconnected cells). > > > > > > Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP > > +1 916 966 9060 > > FAX +1 916 966 9068 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =============================================== > > > > > > On 8/8/2011 8:33 AM, JWF wrote: > > > > > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive > > > shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any > > > electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I > > > pressed Start and got this: > > > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > > > Sometimes a single click. > > > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > > > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left > > > hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes > > > all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes > > > they go off the first time I push the button. > > > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts > > > right up. > > > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > > > ONE: what's wrong? > > > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep > > > starting once in while, while I work on it? > > > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >

[dat brooklyn bum]

Check the starter solenoid connections. Often, the little two-wire plastic connector wiggles loose and can cause the symptoms you describe. Pull it off, make sure the female connectors aren't ovalled, add dielectric grease, and then reconnect. You can also short the two large pole connectors on the solenoid with a screwdriver or other plastic/rubber handled metal tool when you are experiencing the problem. If you are able to start the bike this way, your problem could be in the starter switch assembly itself, though that is rare. Let us know what you find as you start tracking the electrical gremlins. da Vermonster

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "JWF" wrote: > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I pressed Start and got this: > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > Sometimes a single click. > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes they go off the first time I push the button. > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts right up. > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > ONE: what's wrong? > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep starting once in while, while I work on it? > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF >

[West Hovland]

Ditto to what is reported below. I've had issues with the connections on the starter solenoid that have caused these symptoms... took the all the connections apart, cleaned and reassembled... viola! West

> > Check the starter solenoid connections. Often, the little two-wire plastic connector wiggles loose and can cause the symptoms you describe. Pull it off, make sure the female connectors aren't ovalled, add dielectric grease, and then reconnect. You can also short the two large pole connectors on the solenoid with a screwdriver or other plastic/rubber handled metal tool when you are experiencing the problem. If you are able to start the bike this way, your problem could be in the starter switch assembly itself, though that is rare. >

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[RobertWichert]

Yes, Jeff, but in my response I mentioned that a bad connection can sometimes fail ONLY UNDER LOAD. This is not uncommon. Your test cranking will check this. I don't know about Battery Tenders. Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP +1 916 966 9060 FAX +1 916 966 9068 ===============================================

On 8/10/2011 4:01 PM, Jeff Khoury wrote: > > I'm not Robert, but I'll try to answer: probably not. > > I test batteries like so: > > Inspect/Check/Tighten all connectors on the battery, solenoid and ground. > > Check fluid levels in battery (if required) > > Charge it on a slow rate overnight. > > Take off the charger and let it "rest" for an hour or so. > > Check the voltage with a meter (key off). Look for 11.8v or more. > > Turn the key on, watch the battery voltage while cranking. If the > voltage drops below 10v while cranking, you have a bad battery. > > Leave it off the tender/charger and try again the next day to see if > the battery will hold the charge. > > It's always worked for me. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JWF" > > To: "DSN KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2011 3:35:43 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Start Button Intermittent > > Robert, would the Battery Tender show the battery as fully charged if > it was internally damaged? -JWF > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > , RobertWichert wrote: > > > > Probably bad connection somewhere. I'd start at the battery terminals. > > Could be bad connection INSIDE the battery (shorted or disconnected > cells). > > > > > > Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP > > +1 916 966 9060 > > FAX +1 916 966 9068 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =============================================== > > > > > > On 8/8/2011 8:33 AM, JWF wrote: > > > > > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive > > > shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any > > > electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I > > > pressed Start and got this: > > > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > > > Sometimes a single click. > > > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > > > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left > > > hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes > > > all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes > > > they go off the first time I push the button. > > > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts > > > right up. > > > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > > > ONE: what's wrong? > > > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep > > > starting once in while, while I work on it? > > > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Jeff Khoury]

//Yes, Jeff, but in my response I mentioned that a bad connection can sometimes fail ONLY UNDER LOAD.// Agreed. I've seen a number of batteries with "bad cells" that would test fine until you put a decent load on it. I was agreeing completely with you, sorry if it sounded like I was contradicting you. Battery tenders are "semi-smart" devices but even the best of them won't load test the battery. The only way that a shadetree mechanic can know for sure is to do the crank test with a voltmeter. Expanding on Robert's observation that connections will fail under load, if you hit the button and the bike doesn't crank AND the battery voltage remains above 10v or so, you have a problem with supplying enough current to the starter (or the starter's dead). That's when it's time to go through all the connections, the solenoid (contacts in solenoids go bad from time-to-time) with a fine-tooth comb.

----- Original Message ----- From: "RobertWichert" To: "Jeff Khoury" Cc: "JWF" , "DSN KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 11:17:47 AM Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Start Button Intermittent Yes, Jeff, but in my response I mentioned that a bad connection can sometimes fail ONLY UNDER LOAD. This is not uncommon. Your test cranking will check this. I don't know about Battery Tenders. Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP +1 916 966 9060 FAX +1 916 966 9068 =============================================== On 8/10/2011 4:01 PM, Jeff Khoury wrote: I'm not Robert, but I'll try to answer: probably not. I test batteries like so: Inspect/Check/Tighten all connectors on the battery, solenoid and ground. Check fluid levels in battery (if required) Charge it on a slow rate overnight. Take off the charger and let it "rest" for an hour or so. Check the voltage with a meter (key off). Look for 11.8v or more. Turn the key on, watch the battery voltage while cranking. If the voltage drops below 10v while cranking, you have a bad battery. Leave it off the tender/charger and try again the next day to see if the battery will hold the charge. It's always worked for me. ----- Original Message ----- From: "JWF" < jwflower53@... > To: "DSN KLR650" < DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2011 3:35:43 PM Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Start Button Intermittent Robert, would the Battery Tender show the battery as fully charged if it was internally damaged? -JWF --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com , RobertWichert wrote: > > Probably bad connection somewhere. I'd start at the battery terminals. > Could be bad connection INSIDE the battery (shorted or disconnected cells). > > > Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP > +1 916 966 9060 > FAX +1 916 966 9068 > > > > > > > > > > > > =============================================== > > > On 8/8/2011 8:33 AM, JWF wrote: > > > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive > > shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any > > electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I > > pressed Start and got this: > > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > > Sometimes a single click. > > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left > > hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes > > all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes > > they go off the first time I push the button. > > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts > > right up. > > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > > ONE: what's wrong? > > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep > > starting once in while, while I work on it? > > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

[RobertWichert]

I actually own a Battery Tender, and I have no idea how it works. I guess that I HOPE it works. : ) Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP +1 916 966 9060 FAX +1 916 966 9068 ===============================================

On 8/11/2011 11:45 AM, Jeff Khoury wrote: > > //Yes, Jeff, but in my response I mentioned that a bad connection can > sometimes fail ONLY UNDER LOAD.// > > Agreed. I've seen a number of batteries with "bad cells" that would > test fine until you put a decent load on it. I was agreeing completely > with you, sorry if it sounded like I was contradicting you. > > Battery tenders are "semi-smart" devices but even the best of them > won't load test the battery. The only way that a shadetree mechanic > can know for sure is to do the crank test with a voltmeter. > > Expanding on Robert's observation that connections will fail under > load, if you hit the button and the bike doesn't crank AND the battery > voltage remains above 10v or so, you have a problem with supplying > enough current to the starter (or the starter's dead). That's when > it's time to go through all the connections, the solenoid (contacts in > solenoids go bad from time-to-time) with a fine-tooth comb. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "RobertWichert" > > To: "Jeff Khoury" > > Cc: "JWF" >, "DSN > KLR650" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 11:17:47 AM > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Start Button Intermittent > > Yes, Jeff, but in my response I mentioned that a bad connection can > sometimes fail ONLY UNDER LOAD. This is not uncommon. Your test > cranking will check this. I don't know about Battery Tenders. > Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP > +1 916 966 9060 > FAX +1 916 966 9068 > > =============================================== > On 8/10/2011 4:01 PM, Jeff Khoury wrote: > > I'm not Robert, but I'll try to answer: probably not. > > I test batteries like so: > > Inspect/Check/Tighten all connectors on the battery, solenoid and ground. > > Check fluid levels in battery (if required) > > Charge it on a slow rate overnight. > > Take off the charger and let it "rest" for an hour or so. > > Check the voltage with a meter (key off). Look for 11.8v or more. > > Turn the key on, watch the battery voltage while cranking. If the > voltage drops below 10v while cranking, you have a bad battery. > > Leave it off the tender/charger and try again the next day to see if > the battery will hold the charge. > > It's always worked for me. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "JWF" < jwflower53@... > > To: "DSN KLR650" < DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2011 3:35:43 PM > Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: Start Button Intermittent > > Robert, would the Battery Tender show the battery as fully charged if > it was internally damaged? -JWF > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > , RobertWichert wrote: > > > > Probably bad connection somewhere. I'd start at the battery terminals. > > Could be bad connection INSIDE the battery (shorted or disconnected > cells). > > > > > > Robert P. Wichert P.Eng LEED AP > > +1 916 966 9060 > > FAX +1 916 966 9068 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =============================================== > > > > > > On 8/8/2011 8:33 AM, JWF wrote: > > > > > > Well, I finally put my A13 back together with the new Progressive > > > shock. Had had the battery out, on a Battery Tender. Didn't do any > > > electrical work. It started fine 12-20 times over three days. Then I > > > pressed Start and got this: > > > Sometimes nothing, no click, nothing. > > > Sometimes a single click. > > > Sometimes a series of clicks, sounds like rice crispies. > > > I've tried it with the lights on and off (I have the aftermarket left > > > hand control module that lets you turn off all the lights): Sometimes > > > all the lights work even when the button just clicks. But sometimes > > > they go off the first time I push the button. > > > Sometimes after all this fiddling, the button works and she starts > > > right up. > > > Last night I rode 20 miles after all this, and all seemed fine. > > > ONE: what's wrong? > > > TWO: is it safe to ride it in this condition, assuming it will keep > > > starting once in while, while I work on it? > > > Any suggestions much appreciated. Thanks- JWF > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]