Wilsons Sandbox

Listers, Heads, I just saw an add from Sears for SATURDAY ONLY showing a multimeter on sale at 40% off retail. It's a Craftsman digital multimeter model 82146 which normally sells for $24.99 and will be on sale for one day only for $14.99. It measures AC/DC volts, current (I'm guessing up to 10 amps but it doesn't say) and resistance. The picture in the add also shows a voltage pen which I think is included and is normally about $9-10. I think this might be a little large for carrying on the bike but it makes a nice addition to a home workshop. If you decide to purchase one may I suggest you consider also getting a set of leads with alligator clips on one end as I don't think they come with this item. No need to join a club to get this nice price. Again this is Saturday only. Best, Jeff Saline ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT ____________________________________________________________ Learn about VA loan programs and benefits. Click now. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m3mWxtelwSnJ28LBgLuE6FxDGfqyeNBCgU8HTNxqqnpHWw0/

Amazing how useful these little multimeters are. When a car mechanic checked out the state of my Escort wagon s charging system ( I only buy fine machinery, rapport between man and machine and all that ), his giant unit did the same tests and got the same readings as my multimeter did. Jeff....do you think this Craftsman item is significantly superior to my $10 Harbor Freight meter ? Bogdan

On 8/22/08 9:56 AM, "Jeff Saline" wrote: > > > > Listers, Heads, > > I just saw an add from Sears for SATURDAY ONLY showing a multimeter on > sale at 40% off retail. > > It's a Craftsman digital multimeter model 82146 which normally sells for > $24.99 and will be on sale for one day only for $14.99. > > It measures AC/DC volts, current (I'm guessing up to 10 amps but it > doesn't say) and resistance. > > The picture in the add also shows a voltage pen which I think is included > and is normally about $9-10. > > I think this might be a little large for carrying on the bike but it > makes a nice addition to a home workshop. > > If you decide to purchase one may I suggest you consider also getting a > set of leads with alligator clips on one end as I don't think they come > with this item. > > No need to join a club to get this nice price. Again this is Saturday > only. > > Best, > > Jeff Saline > ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal > Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org > The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota > 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT > __________________________________________________________ > Learn about VA loan programs and benefits. Click now. > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3m3mWxtelwSnJ28LBgLuE6FxDGfq > yeNBCgU8HTNxqqnpHWw0/ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 11:07:49 -0600 Bogdan Swider writes:

> Amazing how useful these little multimeters are. When a car mechanic > checked > out the state of my Escort wagon s charging system ( I only buy > fine > machinery, rapport between man and machine and all that ), his giant > unit > did the same tests and got the same readings as my multimeter did. > Jeff....do you think this Craftsman item is significantly superior > to my $10 > Harbor Freight meter ? > > Bogdan

<><><><><><><><><> <><><><><><><><><> Bogdan, I don't know about Harbor Freight meters. But as a general rule I don't buy anything from Harbor Freight that's intended purpose is to cut or measure. No drill bits, hacksaw blades, razor knives, multimeters, rulers or tape measures, infrared temperature indicators, etc. The one item I have found from Harbor Freight that is accurate and holds up well is a 6" digital caliper by CenTech. I've had one for about 10 years and it is accurate to 0.001" (or better) and just works great. I think it depends on the use a person expects for the item as to whether it's a good deal or not. If all you want to know is general information like, do I have voltage, just about anything could be ok. If you are needing accurate information then an accurate meter is needed. Kind of like tire pressure gauges. If you use the same gauge all the time then it doesn't really matter if it's accurate for PSI as long as it's consistent. But if you are trying to tell someone else what PSI you run then it needs to be accurate too. I've seen plenty of multimeters (and tire pressure gauges) that were consistent but not accurate. If a specification calls for 13.8 volts at 3,500 rpm then your instrument better be capable of reading that voltage accurately. Same for your revolution counter. So I guess it depends on a few things but I don't have any Harbor Freight multimeters in my shop. I do check my meters against each other and have checked them against Fluke meters just back from calibration to see how accurate mine are. The Craftsman meters in my experience are pretty accurate and plenty good enough for most motorcycle work. Best, Jeff Saline ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT ____________________________________________________________ Free information - Scholarships for college, university or tech school. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3l9RWrxuAX3cUEFycBT7D7ieBL56PwBa4ZpsoLhaMuQIx60s/

I've bought the expensive ones and the $4 ones from Harbor Freight. Can't tell any difference in them. don a17

On Aug 22, 2008, at 10:56 AM, Jeff Saline wrote: Listers, Heads, I just saw an add from Sears for SATURDAY ONLY showing a multimeter on sale at 40% off retail. It's a Craftsman digital multimeter model 82146 which normally sells for $24.99 and will be on sale for one day only for $14.99. It measures AC/DC volts, current (I'm guessing up to 10 amps but it doesn't say) and resistance. The picture in the add also shows a voltage pen which I think is included and is normally about $9-10. I think this might be a little large for carrying on the bike but it makes a nice addition to a home workshop. If you decide to purchase one may I suggest you consider also getting a set of leads with alligator clips on one end as I don't think they come with this item. No need to join a club to get this nice price. Again this is Saturday only. Best, Jeff Saline ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT __________________________________________________________ Learn about VA loan programs and benefits. Click now. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/ Ioyw6i3m3mWxtelwSnJ28LBgLuE6FxDGfqyeNBCgU8HTNxqqnpHWw0/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Don, a lot I know about meters may not seem to be of much importance for working on a KLR, but the problem is will the meter that you buy only be used on a KLR or at some point will you plug it into a wall outlet. If you do, is it fuse protected, double insulated or is it going to blow up in your face. Sounds a little fatalist but I've seen blown meters it can be pretty impressive. I've had this conversation with many apprentices and other trades people over the years, and strangely a lot of them would never consider using say anything but Klein pliers and screwdrivers but think anything close to100 bucks is outrageous for a meter. If a meter doesn't have at least a Cat.1 rating as far as I'm concerned it shouldn't even be sold, all of my meters, personal and company owned are rated Cat.3, 1000 volts. There are other considerations when buying a meter, even for use on a KLR, does it have a diode test setting, pretty much need that for checking the rectifier. How accurate is it going to be at any frequency other then 60Hz, the supply from your stator is going to be much higher than that. Is the meter itself of sufficiently high impedance so it doesn't affect the circuit your working on making your measurements less then accurate. Does it have a Hold or Record functions, the min/max record function on a lot of meters today are more valuable then some of the apprentices I've had..........There are many other considerations that I could go on and on to tell you about but if you cheap out on a meter don't use it on any voltage higher then the 12 volts on your bike and don't even use it there on high current circuits like your battery. While it doesn't have anything to do with the topic of meters a little story about a repair I worked on pretty much day and night last Wed, Thurs, and Friday. The plant I work in had one of it's 6000 amp services blow up, cause was a mixture of heavy rain and pigeon shit which ate through the top cover of some buss duct and shorted it out. I believe there was 24 approximately 3/8" x 6" solid copper buss bars in the duct. Where it shorted it burnt all of them pretty much off. When it blew workers on the other side of the building from the substation saw the flames shoot up past the roof of that section of the building, the roof there is I believe 80 feet high. The best replacement for buss duct is single conductor teck cable run in ladder tray. It took 24 runs of 1000mcm tech (about the size of your wrist before the armour is removed) 90 feet long to reconnect, 3 phase plus neutral, six conductors for each. Each cable weighed something over 800 pounds. The cost for the wire alone before tax was $76,000. Sorry to be so long winded but like any tool you need the right tool for the job, a cheap wrench will skin your knuckles or round the edges off your nuts, or at least your bikes nuts but a cheap meter can really damage you, Consider what you will be looking at if your meter blows up, might be the last thing that you actually get to see for a while. Anyway just some stuff to consider when you when you are about to buy a 4 dollar meter. Anyway there are a couple links below that provide some pretty good info on meters for anyone who is interested and I certainly don't mean that everyone should run out and buy a 400 dollar meter but make sure what you buy is good enough and safe enough for what you are going to use it for.....have a great evening....Greg http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/dow ... 75_a_w.pdf http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Dow ... 70_B_w.pdf

--- On Fri, 8/22/08, Don Bittle wrote: From: Don Bittle Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] NKLR, OT, Multimeter On Sale SATURDAY To: "Jeff Saline" Cc: DSN_klr650@yahoogroups.com, airheads@... Received: Friday, August 22, 2008, 6:54 PM I've bought the expensive ones and the $4 ones from Harbor Freight. Can't tell any difference in them. don a17 On Aug 22, 2008, at 10:56 AM, Jeff Saline wrote: Listers, Heads, I just saw an add from Sears for SATURDAY ONLY showing a multimeter on sale at 40% off retail. It's a Craftsman digital multimeter model 82146 which normally sells for $24.99 and will be on sale for one day only for $14.99. It measures AC/DC volts, current (I'm guessing up to 10 amps but it doesn't say) and resistance. The picture in the add also shows a voltage pen which I think is included and is normally about $9-10. I think this might be a little large for carrying on the bike but it makes a nice addition to a home workshop. If you decide to purchase one may I suggest you consider also getting a set of leads with alligator clips on one end as I don't think they come with this item. No need to join a club to get this nice price. Again this is Saturday only. Best, Jeff Saline ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads. org The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ Learn about VA loan programs and benefits. Click now. http://thirdpartyof fers.juno. com/TGL2141/ fc/ Ioyw6i3m3mWxtelwSnJ 28LBgLuE6FxDGfqy eNBCgU8HTNxqqnpH Ww0/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __________________________________________________________________ Instant Messaging, free SMS, sharing photos and more... Try the new Yahoo! Canada Messenger at http://ca.beta.messenger.yahoo.com/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I have the meter Jeff brought to our attention; use it on the bike & around the house. Like anything you buy (including the 2 wheel toy variety), it is good for the intended function, non-critical measurements. NASA is not going to use this one on the Mars mission, but it will serve the needs of most people. keep well and keep riding albatross who knows an electron when he sees 1

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, Jeff Saline wrote: > > On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 11:07:49 -0600 Bogdan Swider > writes: > > Amazing how useful these little multimeters are. When a car mechanic > > checked > > out the state of my Escort wagon s charging system ( I only buy > > fine > > machinery, rapport between man and machine and all that ), his giant > > unit > > did the same tests and got the same readings as my multimeter did. > > Jeff....do you think this Craftsman item is significantly superior > > to my $10 > > Harbor Freight meter ? > > > > Bogdan > <><><><><><><><><> > <><><><><><><><><> > > Bogdan, > > I don't know about Harbor Freight meters. But as a general rule I don't > buy anything from Harbor Freight that's intended purpose is to cut or > measure. No drill bits, hacksaw blades, razor knives, multimeters, > rulers or tape measures, infrared temperature indicators, etc. The one > item I have found from Harbor Freight that is accurate and holds up well > is a 6" digital caliper by CenTech. I've had one for about 10 years and > it is accurate to 0.001" (or better) and just works great. > > I think it depends on the use a person expects for the item as to whether > it's a good deal or not. If all you want to know is general information > like, do I have voltage, just about anything could be ok. If you are > needing accurate information then an accurate meter is needed. Kind of > like tire pressure gauges. If you use the same gauge all the time then > it doesn't really matter if it's accurate for PSI as long as it's > consistent. But if you are trying to tell someone else what PSI you run > then it needs to be accurate too. I've seen plenty of multimeters (and > tire pressure gauges) that were consistent but not accurate. If a > specification calls for 13.8 volts at 3,500 rpm then your instrument > better be capable of reading that voltage accurately. Same for your > revolution counter. > > So I guess it depends on a few things but I don't have any Harbor Freight > multimeters in my shop. I do check my meters against each other and have > checked them against Fluke meters just back from calibration to see how > accurate mine are. The Craftsman meters in my experience are pretty > accurate and plenty good enough for most motorcycle work. > > Best, > > Jeff Saline > ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal > Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org > The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota > 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT > ____________________________________________________________ > Free information - Scholarships for college, university or tech school. Click now! > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/Ioyw6i3l9RWrxuAX3cUEFycBT7D7ieBL56PwBa4ZpsoLhaMuQIx60s/ >

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "klr6501995" wrote:

> I would never recommend that any body trust thier life to a cheap > tool. > > Thats' my $.02 worth. >

Realistically, there's little on the KLR that an inexpensive HF DMM couldn't do that would require an expensive one. Measuring milliohms might be one, but even that could be estimated by relative readings. The probe leads are the biggest functional difference; a nice set of longer length quality probes could easily cost ten times the cheap meter, and worth it if frequently used, but 12V measurements would be pretty unlikely to be life threatening. Accuracy of any DMM far exceeds requirements for typical KLR diags. Except: if you keep trying to use it after the low battery warning comes on. With the cheapies it'll read way off, while the quality ones will continue to read accurately until the display is too dim to see any more. So change the battery if the LO bat comes on.. For those that only need a way to measure if the battery is up to snuff or if a fuse has continuity, the $3 HF units are fine. Really no need to scare people saying they'd be lethal. If probing high voltage live circuits, it'd be a good idea not to use a probe that pulled apart, of course. I have a Fluke 88 along with a half dozen HF ones, and I usually reach for what's at hand, which will work fine.

At 6:35 AM +0000 8/25/08, wingerr wrote:

>Realistically, there's little on the KLR that an inexpensive HF DMM >couldn't do that would require an expensive one.... Accuracy of any DMM far >exceeds requirements for typical KLR diags.... >For those that only need a way to measure if the battery is up to >snuff or if a fuse has continuity, the $3 HF units are fine. ... I >have a Fluke 88 along with a half dozen HF >ones, and I usually reach for what's at hand, which will work fine.

Yup. The electrical stuff on a KLR is safe and simple. I use a Fluke 76 at home, but I take a smaller, expendable $7 WalMart unit on the road. Mark

> > > Yup. The electrical stuff on a KLR is safe and simple. I use a Fluke > 76 at home, but I take a smaller, expendable $7 WalMart unit on the > road. > > Mark >

This Saturday I happened to be driving by a Sears so I did pick up the meter and voltage pen on sale. Just like Jeff S. said in his recommendation-$14.99. It ll be interesting to compare this mid price unit s reading to the cheapo compact one that has served me. well. I m no expert mechanic-not to mention electrician that uses tools every day. I just work on my motorcycle and house when they need it. Some thoughts on cheap tools: The scene is a tech session at Fred s in Moab; Eagle Mike is running the show. I ask about the big, macho torque wrench that Mike is using to torque down the rotors; it s a Harbor Freight item. Mike explains why he uses and trusts it. One of the internet forums he s on compared this tool to way more expensive wrenches, including Snap On torquers; some guy conducted tests. The $10-on sale-Harbor Freight tool was found to be more accurate then the Snap On. Yes I know-Snap on services their stuff and possibly the Chinese tools vary more from tool to tool. But hey.....I ll only use it every couple of months. I ran to Harbor Freight and put down my $10; it s worked fine. Bogdan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]