Wilsons Sandbox

Posted: **Sat Jun 02, 2001 3:03 pm**

Hello I've been lurking on the list here for a while. I used to lurk on the W650 list exclusively until I read a few messages from people on this list who owned both bikes and checked it out. I am now less a potential W650 buyer and more a potential KLR buyer. Which is hilarious because about two years ago I wouldn't have imagined Kawasaki could have a bike -much less a new bike- that I'd be interested in and here there are two. So, now that I seem to have a dual sport craving I've been checking out the competitors bikes and comparing. Aesthetically I prefer the green of the late 90's KLRs to the colourful older Ks and the other marquees. The 2001 model with the silver or white splash on the tank kind of turns me off but I know where to buy spray paint in my town anyway so no problem. The fairing on the KLR and the lack of fairing on the other bikes scores another point for the K. And the price, and the archives on the list here where nobody seems to be having any mechanical problems except for cursing the Kawasaki engineering team at valve adjustment time.. A Suzuki salesman told me that the DR650 is a way better bike part for part than the KLR650. He pointed out that the S is evolving while the K has been pretty much the same bike for 15 years (I own an old VW. I like things that don't change). But I am more interested in long road riding with the occasional dirt trail or back alley hooliganism than a dirt bike with turn signals, which the DR seems to be. They don't seem to belong in the same class. The only thing he told me that I found surprising was that everything in the K is chain driven while in the S it's gear driven. And the W650 list guys really like gear driven things. But I haven't read anything about engine rebuilding and cam chain replacing and all that here so I don't believe it is a real problem. So hows this for a first post..... Bye md

Posted: **Sat Jun 02, 2001 5:33 pm**

Hey Monster, That was a great post! I've been on here for a little while and you just convinced me AGAIN!

)))) I ride with a friend that has a DR650 and is pissed that he didn't get a KLR. He wanted one but got impatient to ride and got the DR instead of the KLR. Oh Well... The only thing you would have to do with the way you want to ride (long) is change the seat to avoid "iron butt" and add some hiway pegs! No big deal! Anyway, let us know what you get and happy riding! Greg in Dallas

--- In DSN_klr650@y..., monsterdonkey@h... wrote: > Hello > I've been lurking on the list here for a while. I used to lurk on > the > W650 list exclusively until I read a few messages from people on > this list who owned both bikes and checked it out. I am now less > a potential W650 buyer and more a potential KLR buyer. Which > is hilarious because about two years ago I wouldn't have > imagined Kawasaki could have a bike -much less a new bike- > that I'd be interested in and here there are two. > > So, now that I seem to have a dual sport craving I've been > checking out the competitors bikes and comparing. Aesthetically > I prefer the green of the late 90's KLRs to the colourful older Ks > and the other marquees. The 2001 model with the silver or > white splash on the tank kind of turns me off but I know where to > buy spray paint in my town anyway so no problem. The fairing on > the KLR and the lack of fairing on the other bikes scores another > point for the K. And the price, and the archives on the list here > where nobody seems to be having any mechanical problems > except for cursing the Kawasaki engineering team at valve > adjustment time.. > > A Suzuki salesman told me that the DR650 is a way better bike > part for part than the KLR650. He pointed out that the S is > evolving while the K has been pretty much the same bike for 15 > years (I own an old VW. I like things that don't change). But I am > more interested in long road riding with the occasional dirt trail > or back alley hooliganism than a dirt bike with turn signals, > which the DR seems to be. They don't seem to belong in the > same class. The only thing he told me that I found surprising > was that everything in the K is chain driven while in the S it's gear > driven. And the W650 list guys really like gear driven things. But I > haven't read anything about engine rebuilding and cam chain > replacing and all that here so I don't believe it is a real problem. > > So hows this for a first post..... > Bye > md

Posted: **Sat Jun 02, 2001 7:57 pm**

monsterdonkey@... wrote:

> Hello > I've been lurking on the list here for a while. . . > > So, now that I seem to have a dual sport craving I've been > checking out the competitors bikes and comparing. . . > > A Suzuki salesman told me that the DR650 is a way better bike > part for part than the KLR650.

_----------------------------- Welcome to the only sane list on the internet. If you don't believe it, just ask one of us. The first thing you need to do is disregard anything any salesman tells you. Second thing you need to do is ride both the KLR and the DR650. Both bikes are great. The DR kicks the KLR's ass out of the box, but its seat will kick yours. There is probably more aftermarket goodies available for the KLR, but the DR doesn't need much. Both if them are too heavy to do serious technical riding. Niether is a road bike. They are both overweight compromises. You need to ride one of each before you can make an intelligent judgement between the two. I like my KLR for its geometry, and road handling. The color is alright if your fond of garbage bags, but at least it is memorable. I hate the way the KLR vibrates, the seat is too wide for stand up riding. Rubber foot pegs aren't for dirt riding. There's too much shit in front of the rider for riding in the dirt. It's cold natured. It's noisy even with the stock pipe. Tends to stall easy at low RPM's (not good for technical riding.) Hot air blast on both legs is annoying and uncomfortable. It's top heavy, probably from all the plastic and the large gas tank capacity. I like my DR for its out of the box punch, gear ratios, and lack of extraneous plastic. Vibrates less. Quiet. Colors are so boring that I can't even tell you what they are without looking at it. Starts and runs immediately without the choke. I hate the 2x6 pine board seat, and the frame geometry that makes you feel like you're going slightly down hill. The heat on your right leg from the oil cooler is almost unbearable at low speed. My personal choice between the two is the DR. But I like my XT225 better than either! I will eventually sell the KLR. I have just purchased a 1977 GS550 with 2000 miles on it and will restore it to use on the road. Motorcycle riding is all about compromise and personal preferences. Listen to everyone with a jaundiced ear. After all; a rider that's never ridden anything in his life but a Harley will tell you it's the greatest bike there is. Opinions are like assholes; everyone has at least one. Ride everything you can find. Make your judgement from experience rather than from opinions and you won't be sorry. Or, do what many of us have done, buy one of everything; sell only the ones you don't like or are redundant. I never met a motorcycle I didn't like. -- Dan (BIERDO) Oaks, President Formtech Services, Inc. '01 XT225 '01 KLR650 '99 DR650 '82 XL250R '78 TC90 '77 GS550 '91 Yammy 4 stroke golf cart 2 bad dogs and a sled Mfr. of Printing Equipment & Supplies formtech@... bierdo@... http://www.formtechservices.com Mfr. of 4x4 POLY Motorcycle Parts bierdo@... http://www.dirtly.com 2970 Robins Nest Ct. Saint Cloud, FL 34772-8182 USA 800 522-6257 407 957-7887 (fax)

Posted: **Sat Jun 02, 2001 9:52 pm**

--- Dan Oaks wrote:

> > The first thing you need to do is disregard

anything

> any salesman tells you. >

Got to believe that! the seat is too wide for stand up riding. Maybe your not bowlegged enough, I never really noticed this??

> Rubber foot pegs aren't for dirt riding.

Scrap yard replacesments. It's cold natured. I ride mine year round, full choke when cool, back it out, ride around the 1st corner and shut off the choke, simple, a 2000 stock and then added a Supercrapp - no change.

> It's noisy even with the stock pipe.

I guess I never noticed any noise wearing earplugs, other have commented on how quiet it was. Tends to stall easy at low RPM's Never had that happen!! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/

Posted: **Sat Jun 02, 2001 10:05 pm**

--- In DSN_klr650@y..., John Irvine wrote:

> > Tends to stall easy at low RPM's > > Never had that happen!!

' It's way better than the ones that stall at high rpms.

Posted: **Sat Jun 02, 2001 10:34 pm**

DAN good advice!!!!! Richard in Tucson 94 KLR650 86 VFR750

> Welcome to the only sane list on the internet. If you don't believe it,

just

> ask one of us. > > The first thing you need to do is disregard anything any salesman tells

you.

> > Second thing you need to do is ride both the KLR and the DR650. > > Both bikes are great. The DR kicks the KLR's ass out of the box, but its > seat will kick yours. > > There is probably more aftermarket goodies available for the KLR, but the

DR

> doesn't need much. > > Both if them are too heavy to do serious technical riding. Niether is a

road

> bike. They are both overweight compromises. You need to ride one of each > before you can make an intelligent judgement between the two. > > I like my KLR for its geometry, and road handling. The color is alright if > your fond of garbage bags, but at least it is memorable. > > I hate the way the KLR vibrates, the seat is too wide for stand up riding. > Rubber foot pegs aren't for dirt riding. There's too much shit in front of > the rider for riding in the dirt. It's cold natured. It's noisy even with > the stock pipe. Tends to stall easy at low RPM's (not good for technical > riding.) Hot air blast on both legs is annoying and uncomfortable. It's

top

> heavy, probably from all the plastic and the large gas tank capacity. > > I like my DR for its out of the box punch, gear ratios, and lack of > extraneous plastic. Vibrates less. Quiet. Colors are so boring that I

can't

> even tell you what they are without looking at it. Starts and runs > immediately without the choke. > > I hate the 2x6 pine board seat, and the frame geometry that makes you feel > like you're going slightly down hill. The heat on your right leg from the > oil cooler is almost unbearable at low speed. > > My personal choice between the two is the DR. > > But I like my XT225 better than either! > > I will eventually sell the KLR. I have just purchased a 1977 GS550 with

2000

> miles on it and will restore it to use on the road. > > Motorcycle riding is all about compromise and personal preferences. Listen > to everyone with a jaundiced ear. After all; a rider that's never ridden > anything in his life but a Harley will tell you it's the greatest bike

there

> is. Opinions are like assholes; everyone has at least one. > > Ride everything you can find. Make your judgement from experience rather > than from opinions and you won't be sorry. > > Or, do what many of us have done, buy one of everything; sell only the

ones

> you don't like or are redundant. > > I never met a motorcycle I didn't like. > > -- > Dan (BIERDO) Oaks, President > Formtech Services, Inc. > > '01 XT225 > '01 KLR650 > '99 DR650 > '82 XL250R > '78 TC90 > '77 GS550 > '91 Yammy 4 stroke golf cart > 2 bad dogs and a sled

Posted: **Sun Jun 03, 2001 9:28 am**

I'd like to rephrase something I said last night when I was tired and not thinking clearly. Opinions are like assholes; everyone has at least one. Some even have one and marry another. Don't take advice from someone who has only been married once; or who only owns one motorcycle. One who is fortunate enough to make the right choice the first time has no experience worth sharing. -- bierdo (That ought to do it! Tee-hee!)

Posted: **Sun Jun 03, 2001 9:47 am**

John, I'm glad you replied. I couldn't figure out what Dan was talking about either. Mine has never had these problems. I didn't even have the VW whistle. I have heard it on other's KLRs, though. The only thing I can think of complaining about is the amount of mods required to be able to ride enduro and the top-heaviness, because of the big tank. I don't complain, though, because my friend had to make more mods (more expensive) to make his XR650R street legal. And he still has to kick and kick and kick. I know we all have opinions, but I test road the DR650 and it doesn't work nearly as well on the roads as the KLR and the seat is HARD. It didn't seem to run as well off the lot either (may be the dealer's fault. It was low on gas). I would compare it directly to a Honda XR650L. I've ridden the Honda XRs and I like them for the purpose they were designed (enduro). I may even get one some day, but in the mean time, while my friends are loading and unloading their bikes I am riding. -Lance

--- In DSN_klr650@y..., John Irvine wrote: > > --- Dan Oaks wrote: > > > The first thing you need to do is disregard > anything > > any salesman tells you. > > > Got to believe that! > > the seat is too wide for stand up riding. > > Maybe your not bowlegged enough, I never really > noticed this?? > > > Rubber foot pegs aren't for dirt riding. > > Scrap yard replacesments. > > It's cold natured. > > I ride mine year round, full choke when cool, back it > out, ride around the 1st corner and shut off the > choke, simple, a 2000 stock and then added a > Supercrapp - no change. > > > It's noisy even with the stock pipe. > > I guess I never noticed any noise wearing earplugs, > other have commented on how quiet it was. > > Tends to stall easy at low RPM's > > Never had that happen!! > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 > a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/

Posted: **Sun Jun 03, 2001 10:33 am**

--- In DSN_klr650@y..., monsterdonkey@h... wrote:

> Hello > I am now less > a potential W650 buyer and more a potential KLR buyer. Which > is hilarious because about two years ago I wouldn't have > imagined Kawasaki could have a bike -much less a new bike- > that I'd be interested in and here there are two.

The KLR is a 15 year old design.

> > The 2001 model with the silver or > white splash on the tank kind of turns me off but I know where to > buy spray paint in my town anyway so no problem.

The 2002 will be coming out in a month or 2. wait to see the new color.

> > A Suzuki salesman told me that the DR650 is a way better bike > part for part than the KLR650. He pointed out that the S is > evolving while the K has been pretty much the same bike for 15 > years (I own an old VW. I like things that don't change).

The KLR is water cooled which I think is better for the street. You don't have to worry about a broken radiator with the DR. If you do more dirt riding get the DR. If it's more street get the KLR.

> > So hows this for a first post..... > Bye > md

Posted: **Sun Jun 03, 2001 12:37 pm**

Hi; Read your post with great interest. Having owned both a 96 KLR650 and a 99 DR650 I thought you might be interested in a different perspective. I wanted a KLR for a long time. I saw it as a lightweight adventure tourer and imagined using it primarily for long day tours of Mt. Hood and the Oregon Coastal range. In a way it was many of those things. The fuel range is good, the seating position and the seat are relatively comfortable, the mini-fairing does a so so job of breaking up wind. Unfortunately for me I found that the vibration was hand numbing and I did not care for the top heavy tippy feeling of the bike on dirt road excursions. I never felt like I had full control of it. I stand at 6' and have a 32" inseam. A taller person might easily have felt more in control of the bike and not worried about it. I would not have wanted to ride it on anything rougher than a graded dirt road myself although I know many people do. Enter the DR650. The salesman told you some half-truths. Suzuki did a redesign of the bike in 1996, lightened it, some engine improvements such as a composite material in the cylinder liner for durability improvement and a generally more dirt focused mission than the KLR. Most of the magazines who tested them called it a 50/50 bike, meaning 50 per cent road and 50 per cent dirt. The KLR is often characterized as more 70/30 with a street bias. In my view the DR is infinitely smoother in terms of vibration and due to the fact that the weight mass is carried lower and the bike has a smaller overall feeling I feel much more comfortable on it if the ground turns rough. It simply does not have the top heavy feeling of the KLR. I would also say that the suspension as delivered is better on the Suzuki although neither is as good as a well set up bike with cartridge forks. (It also has the advantage of being able to be lowered further still with a factory kit if the stock bike is still too tall.) The disadvantage of the Suzuki is that the tank is relatively small, 3.5 gal lons I believe, and the seat is not much for extended rides. a larger plastic tank is available from IMS, (5 gallons) and I am sure you could either get a Corbin seat or have the stocker reconfigured. Suzuki also sells a gel seat although it is the same general shape as stock which I would have my doubts about the benefits of. (BTW, changing seats on a KLR is a common thing, many find they can't live with the stock seat on them). It all comes down to preferences and you may find that the vibration of theKLR isn't that big a deal to you, many say so or try to find various cures. For me I felt that the general feel of the DR and smoothness was much preferable. I would far rather change a gas tank and seat than try to overcome basic engineering flaws. Curiously I also found the Suzuki just generally more fun to ride. I find it has a more lively feel to the engine, much easier to wheelie and feels quite a bit faster than the KLR. I doubt if it really is that much, if any faster, but it just feels like it. Either bike has its pros and cons. I suggest you actually ride both before forming any decision unless your heart is just set on the KLR. If so buy it and have a ball. If not give them both a try and I think you will be surprised how different their personalities are.

Wilsons Sandbox

klr - 650 prices..?

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