Wilsons Sandbox

"As for changing the cam chain on the KLR... Whatchatalkinabout! Conall has 80,000 some odd miles on his, and it is rumored that he uses 100% pure extra virgin olive oil (not that tri-mix corn/canola/soy stuff!)... With regular maintenance, and upgrading the tensioner on pre-96 bikes, you shouldn't have to do anything at 30k other than give her a pat and whack open the throttle." Well, I just love to hear stories about guys who have gone the distance without working on their bikes. I'm sure that the KLR and Concours are very reliable, but just because one or two bikes have gone the distance, doesn't make all of them the same. My GS has gone through two clutches due to oil seal failures, a broken tranny shaft, and broken driveshaft, new brake discs, and a blown headgasket in its' 41k mile lifetime (all repaired under warranty or extended warranty). Talk to other BMW owners, and they'll tell you how reliable these bikes are. I don't doubt that some guys go long distances without problems, but I sure haven't been able to. We just have to remember that there is a statistical distribution of these problems, and some bikes are going to be at the extremes (one bike going 80k miles without probs, while another only 9k miles). Now with the KLR being so cheap to buy and maintain, I have no problem "fixing" some design "features" that may cause problems, like the cam chain tensioner upgrade. But when that same "feature" is on a very expensive, do everything motorcycle that is supposed to be designed to go around the world, I get a little irritated. Sorry for the rant, I guess I'm just upset that I should've bought a KLR AND Concours for the price of the GS. Live and learn. Cpt. Ron Sacramento, CA '96 R1100GS "Mothership" Stuck on the side of the road twice: For sale '89 HawkGT "Shop Whore" has never left me stranded on the side of the road in 52k miles '83 XR350R was "Valdez", which also has never left me stranded.

Ron- Good point about the whole reliability issue, but I look at it this way for the KLR (and I do realize that numbers can be made to support anything but... that is an argument for another time) 1) You have an excellent sample of riders on this list, from people who might put 1,000 road miles on their bike a year, to people who do that in a day to people on cross-continent/multi-year trips. 2) On most lists you hear about the bad a whole lot more than the good. Usually because when the sh** goes down, people turn to the list for help. You wait around long enough and you're almost guaranteed to have heard about most everything which could go wrong. Most of the knowledge gleaned from these lists is not from successful experiences, but usually unsuccessful experiences (i.e. stuff a rag in the cylinder head opening when doing a valve adjust so you don't lose any parts). 3) We'll never know exactly the full background and cause for each remarkable failure/success. The guy with a broken cam-chain at 9,000 miles... We don't know if he ever even serviced the bike! Then we have Conall with 80k on his and still going strong... Was he lucky? Did BigK bless his bike? When I was looking to buy a GS/F650 myself, I tuned into IBMWR for awhile. They have a great list for great motorcycles but I didn't want to deal with spline lubes, documented (and un-acknowledged by BMW) surging, cracking drive-shafts, etc. etc. that they *constantly* talked about. My brother who owned a 95 R1100GS had so many problems with it that he had to sell it, and he told me to look at the KLR. So I lurked here for awhile to see what problems would manifest themselves with the KLR and other than constant issues about valve adjustments, balancer tensioner jihad's (and hence the replacement of the chain), the crappy front brakes, there really were not any strong, glaring faults to the bike as far as I could tell. Or perhaps nothing that I didn't have a problem dropping a C-note on. Same with the Connie, it has acknowledged problems, but they're so well documented, that most of the time they are avoided or fixed beforehand. Perhaps what plagued your GS experience is you expected the "BMW experience" which is largely romanticized, I feel. With a KLR you only expect $4k of bike, but you get more, so you're already ahead of the game. Maybe it is because the KLR has such a low entry fee that the KLR riders are much more varied in lifestyle, and less inclined to be buying the bike because of some preconceived (perhaps unfounded) notion of reliability. I just wanna ride... (I am not criticizing your choice of bikes in any way, shape or form, BTW, I mean no offence and I still want a GS). Maybe some of the older listers can reminisce... have we ever lost someone off the list (i.e. sold/shot/burned their KLR) because it having so many problems that they couldn't deal with it? Anyone gotten to the point of no-return with the bike? Sorry for the length... Too much caffeine does weird stuff to me. Ride Safe! ---- Zack SE DC 1991 KLR650 "Buster" 1986 Concours

Maybe some of the older listers can reminisce... have we ever lost someone off the list (i.e. sold/shot/burned their KLR) because it having so many problems that they couldn't deal with it? Anyone gotten to the point of no-return with the bike? __________ curiously enough Zack there were a couple, three that I can remember. One guy claimed it was the worst bike he ever had, everything went wrong, the balancer weights fell apart, the water pump failed, etc. Stuart Heaslet had one of the worst cases (no pun intended) but it was covered under warranty. Then there was the poor bloke who had a mechanic fail to tighten the chain aduster lock nut (or maybe left if off) with big-time problems afterwards. But as you point out not many. In the old days I would spend the next hour searching the early early archives and find them but I'm so buried even a sicko like me can't imagine it...Yep, it is a lot like the Connie, two of the best bargains in motorcycling... Kurt

"curiously enough Zack there were a couple, three that I can remember. One guy claimed it was the worst bike he ever had, everything went wrong, the balancer weights fell apart, the water pump failed, etc. Stuart Heaslet had one of the worst cases (no pun intended) but it was covered under warranty. Then there was the poor bloke who had a mechanic fail to tighten the chain aduster lock nut (or maybe left if off) with big-time problems afterwards. But as you point out not many. In the old days I would spend the next hour searching the early early archives and find them but I'm so buried even a sicko like me can't imagine it...Yep, it is a lot like the Connie, two of the best bargains in motorcycling... Kurt" Well, I'm already sold. Wanna buy my GS? Comes with an extended warranty! Cpt. Ron Wish I could have it all.

Well, I'm already sold. Wanna buy my GS? Comes with an extended warranty! Cpt. Ron Wish I could have it all. _____________ I'm on to you...I lurk on the GS list and I read every detail of the saga...my condolences... Kurt

I apologize for getting so philosophical. I've just started and have been reading "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance". Anyway, I end up having to trust people with my life every day - people I don't nessecarily trust further than I can throw them, and some that would offer a comforting hug just to get close enough to make sure the stab in my back is well placed. Life is a matter of place, and knowing where you are in porportion to it. Most of all, enjoy the view - you never know if you'll be this way again. "Swede" A11 KLR650 ( Mjollnir ) 370 Bultaco Frontera "La senda es mia" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]