Wilsons Sandbox

>> Hi Brad - I waited until I was 38 to buy my first motorcycle. I took the MSF course before I got the bike, got a full-face helmet, swathed myself in leather from head to toe, then rode like I made a neato moving target & everyone was out to get me (still ride that way!). To date, I have had three "accidents": my Mom rear-ended me at a four-way stop (if you want the details, I'll be glad to supply them. We call her "Mother Goose"...), I dumped myself in gravel on a sharp turn going about .2 mph, and I high-sided myself again in pea-gravel going about 10-15 mph. The two gravel incidents were purely my stupidity. I have been fortunate that I have not been hurt badly. One of those gravel dumps would have fractured my skull had I not been wearing a helmet. The other I hairline fractured my collar bone, but after one day of pain I was okay - we were on vacation & continued on. These were all on road bikes. On the KLR I fall down regularly in the dirt with no effects as I wear full gear. Now that the bike is lowered & I can get my feet on the ground (big plus!) I rarely fall down. I do have to work on my steep, rocky downhill technique, though. It's presently fall down at the top, push the bike down, and walk down after it. The only time my husband Dave has fallen was in a big mud puddle that sucked him and the KLR down. He's been riding for better than 20 years. All I can say is if you want to ride, do it! Just ride defensively and always keep your mind right. On the other hand, if you're *really* fearful of going down, don't ride. I think if you fear that enough it will most likely be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

In a message dated 06/30/2000 12:03:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time, bradcdavis@... writes: big snip

> ......and I feel that bike riding and > ownership would be enjoyable, fun and challenging. I > am approaching this purchase seriously in that safety > is the number one issue I don t want to leave my > children fatherless and my wife with only my memory. I > plan to acquire all the safety gear: helmet, gloves, > riding jacket and pants and boots. I am scheduled to > take the MSF class in September. Some of you may have > even noticed my postings of late emphasize safety > wheel alignment, tires, gloves, helmets etc. Preparing > for this purchase has been very sobering.

Hey Brad, I think you will really enjoy the sport of motorcycling and you bring to the table the most important aspect - safety, and the inherent dangers of the sport that I love so much. Recognizing that you can get killed is very important and *managing the risk* is what it is all about. Here is my take on the subject. I do not use my bike as a *daily commuter* - that reduces my risk greatly. I ride mostly for pure enjoyment and try to avoid *time pressures* - I don't rush to get here or there, this also reduces my risk. I seldom subject myself to rush hour or other high traffic conditions - you got it ....low risk. I spend most of my time *in-the-woods* but do have to ride on pavement getting to and from the woods. I do my aggressive riding in the dirt where I can slip-n-slide and a *wipe-out* is usually at low speed with low fees (broken parts & bodily injury). On pavement - I'm a conservative rider, never riding at 10/10. So Brad, count the cost, decide how you are going to manage the risk, and most importantly.........if you want to experience a great sport......buy that motorcycle and discover a wonderful thing! Stay in the woods till you get some experience. Master the art of going slow before you go fast. Find some riding buddies that you trust and that can teach you how to ride, they can shorten the learning curve by showing you what and how to do things. Then venture out a little further........but, try to avoid the cagers as much as possible. Dr. Knot; PhD (Pretty honda Dude) educated in cyc-all-o-g-y at the Hi-Side U.

At 9:02 AM -0700 6/30/2000, Brad Davis wrote:

>Well, the fact is, my feelings on this >purchase cycle from excitement to fear. Every accident >or close call I read about in this newsgroup makes my >chest tighten up with apprehension! > >Well, I didn t want this to be a therapy session but I >was hoping that some of you could share your thought >or feelings on this with me. My wife is not real >excited about this purchase but knows I ll be careful >and is glad about my safety concerns.

There's no shame in being apprehensive. The big thing to consider is "know thyself". I'm 33 and have always been adventurous. As a kid, I was always exploring and experimenting. Now I ride a motorcycle in all types of conditions, have a pilot's license, work occasionally in tiny research submarines at depths of two miles, etc. I'm not in a hurry to die. I too have a wife, children, etc.... so I'm careful not to make stupid decisions "on the fly". But my father was taken from me when I was five. How? He was on his way home from a week-long business trip (normally a safe activity) and a drunk driver caused a 6 car pile up with no survivors. I'll never forget the night we heard a car in the driveway thinking dad was home and discovering it was a two State Troopers coming to the door. Remember, you can be yanked off this earth at any moment, so don't let that stop you from learning something new or trying something defined by many as "dangerous". It's a big wonderful world out there with many fun things to see and do. Don't let fear immobilize you. I'd rather die doing something I enjoy than die crossing the street on my way to the office. Mark (who's next big task it to jump out of a perfectly good airplane) B2 A2

I agree. Life is a self-fulfilling prophecy to a large degree. I once heard an interview with race car driver Mario Andretti where they were talking about getting into an accident. Mario replied that if you keep thinking about getting into an accident or getting hurt you probably will. I have been a little bit spooked by the recent talk of accidents, but I have always been well aware of how dangerous motorcycles really are. I think fear is both an ally and an enemy. Used correctly, fear is your friend and can help you. Used incorrectly, fear can kill you. Before every ride I do a ritual walk around of my bike. This is done for 2 reasons; 1 to psych myself up into a zone and 2, to become intimately familiar with my bike and to make sure its in good shape because my life depends on it. This may sound strange, but I have bonded with my motorcycle and I am one with it. I view every ride as if I were in combat. I'm very tuned in and in focus at ALL times. If you lunch for a split second, you're done. Situational awareness at ALL times is very important. Being able to read the traffic and other drivers is also important so you can reliably predict what they will PROBABLY do. For the most part, I can predict what other drivers will do before they do it. Keep yourself in good physical condition. You all should be exercising regularly; strength and aerobic capacity are very important. All of this takes a good deal of discipline. I believe there are people who were never meant to ride. IMHO if you're afraid of anything , then stay away from it. I'm afraid of guns and I believe everyone has a right to have one, but since they scare me, I choose not to own or have anything to do with a gun. I'm afraid of going to prison or jail because I'm afraid of getting *&*&* up the @$# so I obey the law and stay away from and out of trouble. I'm NOT afraid of motorcycles or riding. If you don't feel comfortable, confident, and sure, then stay off of motorcycles. Yeh I got to go make it happen. Take the world in a love embrace. Fire all of your guns at once and explode into space. Like a true nature's child, I was born, born to be wild I can fly so high, I never want to die. Rock on people and have a most excellent Independence day weekend. Ride safe -Brian Shepard Philadelphia PA A13 -----Original Message----- From: clantz@... [mailto:clantz@...] Sent: Friday, June 30, 2000 12:36 PM To: DSN_klr650@egroups.com Subject: RE: [DSN_klr650] A Serious Question >> Hi Brad - I waited until I was 38 to buy my first motorcycle. I took the MSF course before I got the bike, got a full-face helmet, swathed myself in leather from head to toe, then rode like I made a neato moving target & everyone was out to get me (still ride that way!). To date, I have had three "accidents": my Mom rear-ended me at a four-way stop (if you want the details, I'll be glad to supply them. We call her "Mother Goose"...), I dumped myself in gravel on a sharp turn going about .2 mph, and I high-sided myself again in pea-gravel going about 10-15 mph. The two gravel incidents were purely my stupidity. I have been fortunate that I have not been hurt badly. One of those gravel dumps would have fractured my skull had I not been wearing a helmet. The other I hairline fractured my collar bone, but after one day of pain I was okay - we were on vacation & continued on. These were all on road bikes. On the KLR I fall down regularly in the dirt with no effects as I wear full gear. Now that the bike is lowered & I can get my feet on the ground (big plus!) I rarely fall down. I do have to work on my steep, rocky downhill technique, though. It's presently fall down at the top, push the bike down, and walk down after it. The only time my husband Dave has fallen was in a big mud puddle that sucked him and the KLR down. He's been riding for better than 20 years. All I can say is if you want to ride, do it! Just ride defensively and always keep your mind right. On the other hand, if you're *really* fearful of going down, don't ride. I think if you fear that enough it will most likely be a self-fulfilling prophecy. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Never lose a file again. Protect yourself from accidental deletes, overwrites, and viruses with @Backup. Try @Backup it's easy, it's safe, and it's FREE! Click here to receive 300 MyPoints just for trying @Backup. http://click.egroups.com/1/5669/6/_/911801/_/962382642/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Visit the KLR650 archives at http://www.listquest.com/lq/search.html?ln=klr650 Support Dual Sport News... dsneditor@... Let's keep this list SPAM free! Visit our site at http://www.egroups.com/group/DSN_klr650 To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: DSN_klr650-unsubscribe@egroups.com

>>>>

But my father was taken from me when I was five. How? He was on his way home from a week-long business trip (normally a safe activity) and a drunk driver caused a 6 car pile up with no survivors.

>>>>

My hero worship is reserved for Gus Grissom. He flew in Korea before training as a test pilot at Edwards, and then went into NASA. All highly risky ventures, but he died on the ground because of a frayed wire. A @#$ poor reason for a great man to die. Go figure...

Buy the bike, keep your ego in check, drive defensively but not fearfully, ask the good Lord to watch over you, and have a blast! Russel'r DSN_klr650@egroups.com Subject: [DSN_klr650] A Serious Question I am finding myself in a strange emotional state. Please pardon my rambling while I explain my feelings. I hope some of you will tell me if my feelings are normal or not. I have found a great A9 to buy and I have been eagerly waiting for this "moment" for some time. I have wanted a motorcycle since I was 16 and almost bought one twice, but other priorities like college, marriage, kids and home came first. Now, finally, many years later (I am 43) I have some cash saved up (from some "big boy" toys I sold) so that this purchase won't make a severe impact to my families' budget. You would expect that I would be excited that this time has come. Well, the fact is, my feelings on this purchase cycle from excitement to fear. Every accident or close call I read about in this newsgroup makes my chest tighten up with apprehension! And those poor people who have been killed, they could have just as easily been me. Why do I want a KLR? I have asked myself this endlessly. Is it to fulfill a childhood dream? Well, that might be partly it. But I tell myself I am a good back yard mechanic, I drive automobiles very conservatively, and I feel that bike riding and ownership would be enjoyable, fun and challenging. I am approaching this purchase seriously in that safety is the number one issue - I don't want to leave my children fatherless and my wife with only my memory. I plan to acquire all the safety gear: helmet, gloves, riding jacket and pants and boots. I am scheduled to take the MSF class in September. Some of you may have even noticed my postings of late emphasize safety - wheel alignment, tires, gloves, helmets etc. Preparing for this purchase has been very sobering. Well, I didn't want this to be a therapy session but I was hoping that some of you could share your thought or feelings on this with me. My wife is not real excited about this purchase but knows I'll be careful and is glad about my safety concerns. Thanks Everyone. Brad

At 11:09 PM 6/30/00 +0000, Michael Hoyt wrote:

> >I try to remember this- a good rider on a good bike can > > potentially handle any situation as good as or better than that >situation in > > a car. > >I respectfully must disagree with this statement. As the MSF teaches, >motorcycle riders are more vulnerable and less stable than they are >in cars, period.

Hmm. I suspect the MSF is trying to get the point across to newbie riders that a riding a bike isn't as easy to learn as a driving a car. But, I could be wrong. It seemed like a lot of the curriculum in MSF was to put the "fear of Car" into the students. Which I needed most desperately. And I'm glad I got. And, actually, the MSF point (as you stated it) is that the rider is more vulnerable and less stable on a bike than in a car. But that doesn't contradict the previous point. Just more skills necessary to handle the situation... All of my practice on motorized vehicles for the last year and a half has been on my KLR or my CBR. I haven't driven a car except for the 2 weeks where I sprained my ankle. I purposely rented an old car that already had dents from Rent-A-Wreck because I knew that I was poor at gauging my car abilities. (Plus, it was cheap.) At this point, I believe I can handle most road situations better on a bike than in a car simply because I haven't had the experience/practice time in a car for too long.

>Two things are fact: 1) on a percentage basis no more >MCs wreck than cars 2) Of the wrecks that do occur a much higher >percent of the motorcycle wrecks are fatal.

Where are these facts shown? Can you point me to the study? Or the statistical assessment of accidents? ---o&>o--- Sarah Barwig sarah@...

-----Original Message----- From: Brad Davis To: DSN_klr650@egroups.com DSN_klr650@egroups.com> Date: Friday, June 30, 2000 12:02 PM Subject: [DSN_klr650] A Serious Question

>I am finding myself in a strange emotional state. >Please pardon my rambling while I explain my feelings. >I hope some of you will tell me if my feelings are >normal or not.

They are quite normal, or course. The consequences of things going wrong on a motorcycle are very serious indeed and are worthy of reflection. In my case, I didnt take up riding untill my late 20s. My father was an old-time rider with a bunch of miles on old BSA B33s, Sportsters and the like. He also managed to wreck his knee one time in an offroad accident (easy when your dirt bike is a Sportster with knobbies I am basicaly a risk-averse person by nature and my career and other lifestyle choices have reflected that for the most part. I like government paychecks and the idea of a government pention and thus have no future in Silly.Con Valley or on Wall Street. I dont do a lot of things that are dangerous and am something of a homebody, realy. Dad sold his Sportster when I was about six and motorcycling was always a past-tense thing in my household. I realy didnt have very much interest in assuming the additional risk. Not my style, realy. Then, something a bit suprising happened: my Dad retired and got back into bikes in a big way, as both a restorer and a rider. It started with a couple of clunkers: a '77 Suzi GS750 that a friend had stuck in a shed, then a couple of small, neglected Thumpers. Finaly, he pulled a BMW R100/7 out of a horse parture in North Carolina and resurected it. Its his baby and I dont know how many rear tires he's worn out on the thing. As he moved up through his projects, the older ones would sit idle. My interest rose and I took the licencing test and began riding his hand-me-downs, the prime one being a Yamaha SR250 (a fine engine in search of a motorcycle to carry it . Finaly,the bug bit in earnest and, tired of undersized hand-me-downs, I bought the KLR. It realy has added a lot to my life. Not changed it fundamentaly, but its certainly added a lot of spice and variety. Now I travel a lot more, both over the road and around town. I go to rallys. BMW guys have realy good rallys and I crash these a lot, particularly the ones with what they term "dual-sport rides" (brisk-paced but non-technical rides in the country on a KLR). I meet more people, have more conversations. All good things. It has even lead me to join one of the better mailing lists out there... And, of course, I have assumed more risk. Every time I ride alongside a long stretch of Armco barrier, I have to look down and think about how bad it would be to go down on top of it. Realy, realy bad, I think. Every time a car looks to turn left within 100 miles of me, I cringe and cover the brakes. I have dumped my KLR on pavement (with me on it) three times, the last just this Monday (release agent = Teflon?). It has been dumped in the dirt over a dozen times. Last year I tore down a hundred foot secction of barbed wire fence when I straightened out a section of gravel road at 40 MPH. I have suffered nothing worse that a few scratches and bruises to date, but that may not always be so. Is it worth it? I look at the totality of my life and, for the moment, like the ballance I have struck. I am still not a big fan of doing risky things for the sake of doing them: no bungee jumping in my future, thank you. Much of my life remains pretty boring by some standards and I like it like that. But the KLR and what I do on it (some 9,000 miles a year worth) adds a lot. Its not something I want to give up and have no intention of doing so for a very long time. Look at your life. If you are already nude skydiving twice a week, perhaps you might find that you have already taken on all the risk you care to handle, and thats fine. Or perhaps you are even more risk-shy than I am and should consider taking up origami. That cool, too. Live a lifestyle that you are comfortable with. That's one of the biggest favors any of us can do ourselves in our lives. But if you think you can take on a little more risk and want to add a lot more spice, do something to make it happen. Like buy a KLR. And ride the piss out of it. -Tom '96 KLR 650 44,000 somewhat risky but thoroughly entertaining miles.