wanted: klr red plastics

[Ed Chait]

----- Original Message ----- From: "Kimosabe" To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 7:43 PM Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: preventing carb problems? I used Stabil for years and years in my boats, motorcycles and yard equipment but found that after 3-4 months a brown sediment / sludge would form in the tanks and carbs. Perhaps it is due in part to the high heat and humidity here in Florida. Last year I substituted SeaFoam and haven't had a recurrence in any. Call it cleaner or stabilizer, in my limited experience, SeaFoam is far better. Steve in Niceville oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo I think Sea Foam is better than Stabil at stabilizing fuel, but in my experience, Berryman B-12 is better than Sea Foam at cleaning and restoring good carburation. ed A17

[Ed Chait]

----- Original Message ----- From: "Kimosabe" To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 7:49 PM Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: preventing carb problems? I forgot to mention that you may consider an in-line fuel filter to handle the insoluble debris, but I think someone already addressed that. Steve ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Yep, but again, the filter in the tank should be effective in filtering out debris. Not sure why an in-line filter would help, but it's a cheap enough mod to try. ed A17

[Don Pendergraft]

"Chevron with Techron" Heh. I feel guilty if this stuff is really good. I admit to be so cynical about advertising, I just assume it's marketing blather an ignore it. But if some real guys who know about bikes vouch for it, it makes me rethink my opinion on it. I will have to check to see if I can find a Chevron station. I have no gas brand loyalty, so I haven't paid any attention! Oh well. Don+ _____ From: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ed Chait Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 7:41 PM To: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com; ocpianoman Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] Re: preventing carb problems?

----- Original Message ----- From: "ocpianoman" com> To: ups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 1:18 PM Subject: [DSN_KLR650] Re: preventing carb problems? When you use Stabil or SeaFoam do you run the bike long enough to get it in the carb? I've left my GS450 idle for as long as three weeks and don't have that problem. I've use both the above mentioned products. The Stabil is more of a preservative and the SeaFoam is more of a solvent to dissolve deposits. Maybe the brand of gas makes a difference. I use Chevron with Techron as much as possible... oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Yep, I add it when I gas up so it will mix well and then I go for a ride before parking the bike. I just switched to using Chevron with Techron, so maybe that will help. thanks, ed A17 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Don Pendergraft]

This seems to make perfect sense, but I thought I read somewhere that inline fuel filters are to be avoided on the KLR? True? Opinions anyone? Don+ _____ From: DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com [mailto:DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of c cooper Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 7:55 PM To: Ed Chait Cc: dsN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] preventing carb problems? Easy to put one in. Cut the fuel line between the petcock and carb fuel inlet and slide the filter in. You can get an inexpensive see-through one for about $2 from Cycle Gear. Will save you a **bunch** of grief. On my '01, which had no fuel filter when I bought it, the petcock o-rings were deteriorating. Breaking up into tiny bits of stuff that prevented the carb needle and seat from sealing properly. Allowed fuel to overflow through the intake manifold, run past the rings, fill up the crankcase with fuel. Caused problems in both the low and hi fuel circuits. On 10/2/07, Ed Chait net> wrote:

> > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "c cooper" com

>

> To: "Ed Chait" net

>

> Cc: ups.com

>

> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 3:18 PM > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] preventing carb problems? > > > Just curious... do you have an in-line fuel filter? > > > > Nope, no in-line fuel filter. > > ed > A17 > >

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Jeff Saline]

On Wed, 3 Oct 2007 09:07:06 -0500 "Don Pendergraft" writes:

> This seems to make perfect sense, but I thought I read somewhere that > inline > fuel filters are to be avoided on the KLR? True? Opinions anyone? > > > Don+

<><><><><><><> <><><><><><><> Don, I've been using an in line fuel filter on my KLR for about 19,000+ smiles with no problem or issues. Martin installed the same kind in his KLR and had some issues. I think it's a good idea when installing an in line fuel filter to make sure it's vertical and not horizontal. Somehow that seems to make a difference in flow performance. I don't get it but that seems the way it is. I use the same kind of in line fuel filter in my airhead BMWs without issue. I often see the kind I use for sale on a blue and white cardboard display at dealers for about $2-3 a filter. They are kind of a cone shape and have an arrow on them indicating the correct direction of fuel flow. Best, Jeff Saline ABC # 4412 South Dakota Airmarshal Airheads Beemer Club www.airheads.org The Beautiful Black Hills of South Dakota 75 R90/6, 03 KLR650, 79 R100RT

[C COOPER]

Ed, My comments are based on my basic understanding of fuel systems. I know there are some pilots and others on the list that can add (or subtract) from my comments... Water is introduced to the fuel tank with fuel, or from condensation, and settles to the bottom of the tank. It's a normal condition. Happens all the time. That's why part of a plane pre-flight check is to drain a small amount of fuel from the tank(s) (lowest point in the fuel storage system) and check for water. If you find water, you keep draining till it's all gone. The screen on the fuel tube keeps the big hunks of particulate out of the carb, but doesn't do a whole lot to stop fine particulate and soluble or semi-soluble gunk. The screen does a pretty good job of separating/reducing the amount of water that flows down into the carb, but doesn't eliminate the problem completely. Products like Berrymans and SeaFoam include alcohol which combines with the water (I have no idea what the actual chemical process is) so that it runs through the system with/like fuel. IMO that's most of the "work" those products do. An in-line filter adds another layer of water barrier and does a much better job than the screen of reducing fine particulate and semi-soluble gunk. Also, if you are having problems with petcock o-rings, they are after the screen. Without the filter there's nothing there to stop particles from flowing right into the carb. I'm a firm believer in fuel filters. I have a clear one on both of my bikes, and make it a habit to check the filter for little bubbles of water or particulate frequently. Most times, I change the filter before long rides. If I've got my head screwed on right, I also dump a little SeaFoam or other fuel system cleaner in the tank a week or two before I head out. If problems show up it gives me a chance to fix them before I'm stuck in some gas station "praying" to the bike gods. Typically though, I add the fuel system cleaners when I top off just before I head out. At any rate, what I try to keep in mind is that keeping the fuel system clean isn't something you do when you start having problems, it's something you do to prevent problems. SOP... Chuck

On 10/2/07, Ed Chait wrote: > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "c cooper" > To: "Ed Chait" > Cc: dsN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 5:54 PM > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] preventing carb problems? > > > > Easy to put one in. Cut the fuel line between the petcock and carb fuel > > inlet and slide the filter in. You can get an inexpensive see-through > one > > for about $2 from Cycle Gear. Will save you a **bunch** of grief. > > > > I'm thinking of adding one, but I don't understand why the filter in the > tank would be ineffective. It has a very fine screen that shouldn't allow > any significant particles to reach the carb. > > ed > A17 > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Ed Chait]

----- Original Message ----- From: "c cooper" To: "Ed Chait" ; "KLR650@yahoogroupsm" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 11:10 AM Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] preventing carb problems? > Ed, > > My comments are based on my basic understanding of fuel systems. I know > there are some pilots and others on the list that can add (or subtract) > from > my comments... > > Water is introduced to the fuel tank with fuel, or from condensation, and > settles to the bottom of the tank. It's a normal condition. Happens all > the > time. That's why part of a plane pre-flight check is to drain a small > amount > of fuel from the tank(s) (lowest point in the fuel storage system) and > check > for water. If you find water, you keep draining till it's all gone. > > The screen on the fuel tube keeps the big hunks of particulate out of the > carb, but doesn't do a whole lot to stop fine particulate and soluble or > semi-soluble gunk. The screen does a pretty good job of > separating/reducing > the amount of water that flows down into the carb, but doesn't eliminate > the > problem completely. Products like Berrymans and SeaFoam include alcohol > which combines with the water (I have no idea what the actual chemical > process is) so that it runs through the system with/like fuel. IMO that's > most of the "work" those products do. > > An in-line filter adds another layer of water barrier and does a much > better > job than the screen of reducing fine particulate and semi-soluble gunk. > Also, if you are having problems with petcock o-rings, they are after the > screen. Without the filter there's nothing there to stop particles from > flowing right into the carb. > > I'm a firm believer in fuel filters. I have a clear one on both of my > bikes, > and make it a habit to check the filter for little bubbles of water or > particulate frequently. Most times, I change the filter before long rides. > If I've got my head screwed on right, I also dump a little SeaFoam or > other > fuel system cleaner in the tank a week or two before I head out. If > problems > show up it gives me a chance to fix them before I'm stuck in some gas > station "praying" to the bike gods. Typically though, I add the fuel > system > cleaners when I top off just before I head out. At any rate, what I try to > keep in mind is that keeping the fuel system clean isn't something you do > when you start having problems, it's something you do to prevent problems. > SOP... > > Chuck Thanks for the detailed reply Chuck. I appreciate your explanation. I just ordered one of the 90 degree fuel filters from Fred at Arrowhead so I will report back in the future about how it works out. thanks again, regards, ed A17

[W.V. Doran]

I've been using the right angle fuel filter from Fred (http://www.arrowheadmotorsports.com/)for at least 2/3 years and they work very well for me. The right angle allows you to keep the fuel line closer to level with the carb also. I also use SeaFoam according to the directions and it has worked well. WVDoran Scottsdale, AZ Ed Chait wrote:

----- Original Message ----- From: "c cooper" To: "Ed Chait" ; "KLR650@yahoogroupsm" DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 11:10 AM Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] preventing carb problems? > Ed, > > My comments are based on my basic understanding of fuel systems. I know > there are some pilots and others on the list that can add (or subtract) > from > my comments... > > Water is introduced to the fuel tank with fuel, or from condensation, and > settles to the bottom of the tank. It's a normal condition. Happens all > the > time. That's why part of a plane pre-flight check is to drain a small > amount > of fuel from the tank(s) (lowest point in the fuel storage system) and > check > for water. If you find water, you keep draining till it's all gone. > > The screen on the fuel tube keeps the big hunks of particulate out of the > carb, but doesn't do a whole lot to stop fine particulate and soluble or > semi-soluble gunk. The screen does a pretty good job of > separating/reducing > the amount of water that flows down into the carb, but doesn't eliminate > the > problem completely. Products like Berrymans and SeaFoam include alcohol > which combines with the water (I have no idea what the actual chemical > process is) so that it runs through the system with/like fuel. IMO that's > most of the "work" those products do. > > An in-line filter adds another layer of water barrier and does a much > better > job than the screen of reducing fine particulate and semi-soluble gunk. > Also, if you are having problems with petcock o-rings, they are after the > screen. Without the filter there's nothing there to stop particles from > flowing right into the carb. > > I'm a firm believer in fuel filters. I have a clear one on both of my > bikes, > and make it a habit to check the filter for little bubbles of water or > particulate frequently. Most times, I change the filter before long rides. > If I've got my head screwed on right, I also dump a little SeaFoam or > other > fuel system cleaner in the tank a week or two before I head out. If > problems > show up it gives me a chance to fix them before I'm stuck in some gas > station "praying" to the bike gods. Typically though, I add the fuel > system > cleaners when I top off just before I head out. At any rate, what I try to > keep in mind is that keeping the fuel system clean isn't something you do > when you start having problems, it's something you do to prevent problems. > SOP... > > Chuck Thanks for the detailed reply Chuck. I appreciate your explanation. I just ordered one of the 90 degree fuel filters from Fred at Arrowhead so I will report back in the future about how it works out. thanks again, regards, ed A17 WVDoran Scottsdale, AZ --------------------------------- Check out the hottest 2008 models today at Yahoo! Autos. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[C COOPER]

Hah! Another sale that will help the value of my fuel filter stock.... ;~) Great! Hope it helps. Regards, Chuck

> On 10/4/07, Ed Chait wrote: > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "c cooper" > > To: "Ed Chait" ; "KLR650@yahoogroupsm" > > DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 11:10 AM > > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] preventing carb problems? > > > > > > > Ed, > > > > > > My comments are based on my basic understanding of fuel systems. I > > know > > > there are some pilots and others on the list that can add (or > > subtract) > > > from > > > my comments... > > > > > > Water is introduced to the fuel tank with fuel, or from condensation, > > and > > > settles to the bottom of the tank. It's a normal condition. Happens > > all > > > the > > > time. That's why part of a plane pre-flight check is to drain a small > > > amount > > > of fuel from the tank(s) (lowest point in the fuel storage system) and > > > check > > > for water. If you find water, you keep draining till it's all gone. > > > > > > The screen on the fuel tube keeps the big hunks of particulate out of > > the > > > carb, but doesn't do a whole lot to stop fine particulate and soluble > > or > > > semi-soluble gunk. The screen does a pretty good job of > > > separating/reducing > > > the amount of water that flows down into the carb, but doesn't > > eliminate > > > the > > > problem completely. Products like Berrymans and SeaFoam include > > alcohol > > > which combines with the water (I have no idea what the actual chemical > > > > > process is) so that it runs through the system with/like fuel. IMO > > that's > > > most of the "work" those products do. > > > > > > An in-line filter adds another layer of water barrier and does a much > > > better > > > job than the screen of reducing fine particulate and semi-soluble > > gunk. > > > Also, if you are having problems with petcock o-rings, they are after > > the > > > screen. Without the filter there's nothing there to stop particles > > from > > > flowing right into the carb. > > > > > > I'm a firm believer in fuel filters. I have a clear one on both of my > > > bikes, > > > and make it a habit to check the filter for little bubbles of water or > > > > > particulate frequently. Most times, I change the filter before long > > rides. > > > If I've got my head screwed on right, I also dump a little SeaFoam or > > > other > > > fuel system cleaner in the tank a week or two before I head out. If > > > problems > > > show up it gives me a chance to fix them before I'm stuck in some gas > > > station "praying" to the bike gods. Typically though, I add the fuel > > > system > > > cleaners when I top off just before I head out. At any rate, what I > > try to > > > keep in mind is that keeping the fuel system clean isn't something you > > do > > > when you start having problems, it's something you do to prevent > > problems. > > > SOP... > > > > > > Chuck > > > > Thanks for the detailed reply Chuck. I appreciate your explanation. I > > just > > ordered one of the 90 degree fuel filters from Fred at Arrowhead so I > > will > > report back in the future about how it works out. > > > > thanks again, regards, > > > > ed > > A17 > > > > > >

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[C COOPER]

I've had a theory floating around in my head... It's my understanding that condensation in the fuel tank is minimized or eliminated if the carbon canister evaporative device is installed and operating correctly. If you "de-californicate" a bike, does condensation increase and become a problem? Any thoughts?

On 10/4/07, c cooper wrote: > > Hah! Another sale that will help the value of my fuel filter stock.... > ;~) > > Great! Hope it helps. > > Regards, > > Chuck > > > > > On 10/4/07, Ed Chait wrote: > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "c cooper" < klr685@... > > > > To: "Ed Chait" ; "KLR650@yahoogroupsm " > > > DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com > > > > Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2007 11:10 AM > > > Subject: Re: [DSN_KLR650] preventing carb problems? > > > > > > > > > > Ed, > > > > > > > > My comments are based on my basic understanding of fuel systems. I > > > know > > > > there are some pilots and others on the list that can add (or > > > subtract) > > > > from > > > > my comments... > > > > > > > > Water is introduced to the fuel tank with fuel, or from > > > condensation, and > > > > settles to the bottom of the tank. It's a normal condition. Happens > > > all > > > > the > > > > time. That's why part of a plane pre-flight check is to drain a > > > small > > > > amount > > > > of fuel from the tank(s) (lowest point in the fuel storage system) > > > and > > > > check > > > > for water. If you find water, you keep draining till it's all gone. > > > > > > > > The screen on the fuel tube keeps the big hunks of particulate out > > > of the > > > > carb, but doesn't do a whole lot to stop fine particulate and > > > soluble or > > > > semi-soluble gunk. The screen does a pretty good job of > > > > separating/reducing > > > > the amount of water that flows down into the carb, but doesn't > > > eliminate > > > > the > > > > problem completely. Products like Berrymans and SeaFoam include > > > alcohol > > > > which combines with the water (I have no idea what the actual > > > chemical > > > > process is) so that it runs through the system with/like fuel. IMO > > > that's > > > > most of the "work" those products do. > > > > > > > > An in-line filter adds another layer of water barrier and does a > > > much > > > > better > > > > job than the screen of reducing fine particulate and semi-soluble > > > gunk. > > > > Also, if you are having problems with petcock o-rings, they are > > > after the > > > > screen. Without the filter there's nothing there to stop particles > > > from > > > > flowing right into the carb. > > > > > > > > I'm a firm believer in fuel filters. I have a clear one on both of > > > my > > > > bikes, > > > > and make it a habit to check the filter for little bubbles of water > > > or > > > > particulate frequently. Most times, I change the filter before long > > > rides. > > > > If I've got my head screwed on right, I also dump a little SeaFoam > > > or > > > > other > > > > fuel system cleaner in the tank a week or two before I head out. If > > > > problems > > > > show up it gives me a chance to fix them before I'm stuck in some > > > gas > > > > station "praying" to the bike gods. Typically though, I add the fuel > > > > > > > system > > > > cleaners when I top off just before I head out. At any rate, what I > > > try to > > > > keep in mind is that keeping the fuel system clean isn't something > > > you do > > > > when you start having problems, it's something you do to prevent > > > problems. > > > > SOP... > > > > > > > > Chuck > > > > > > Thanks for the detailed reply Chuck. I appreciate your > > > explanation. I just > > > ordered one of the 90 degree fuel filters from Fred at Arrowhead so I > > > will > > > report back in the future about how it works out. > > > > > > thanks again, regards, > > > > > > ed > > > A17 > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]