leaking gas after fill-up

[Blake Sobiloff]

On 8/9/06, Will Gilmore wrote:

> Filling my A12 to anywhere near the top of the tank results in a > steady drip of gas coming form under the tank.

I assume you mean gas comes from the overflow tube? If so, check your owner's manual. Mine said not to fill the tank to the point where gas is inside the dark metal neck inside the filler hole, otherwise the gas will leak out the overflow tube. -- Blake Sobiloff http://sobiloff.typepad.com/> http://sobiloff.typepad.com/klr_adventure/> San Jose, CA (USA)

[blckjck]

Please forgive the previous post... I replied to Mr. Green privatly, went back and sent, just to realize what I sent him wasn't there. Let's try this again... I have had very good success gravity balancing my tires. I use the wheels and trucks that have been remove from a set of roller blades. They have ABEC-7 bearings that offer very little rolling resistance. I mount the trucks on saw horses (anything similar that will provide clearance for the wheel will work). Make sure that the blade wheels are on the same level plane. Using the axle from the bike, support the wheel. Rotate the wheel, it will stop with the heavey side down. When my wheels have been out of balance, I notice it at just past 60MPH. I have taken my balanced wheels past 100MPH with no problems. I would caution using stick-on type weights, especialy if running of road. They can be dislodged by terrian and bumps. Also wear can change the balance of a tire as heavier spots are removed. My 2 cents...

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "blckjck" wrote: > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "E.L. Green" wrote: > > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "James Morrow Sr" > > wrote: > > > > > > This may work, but I would never trust it. A balancer needs > minimal > > > friction. If you don't have grease in your wheel bearings, they > > won't work > > > very long at speed. > > > > Well, all I can tell you is that I can balance my tires to within > 1/4 > > oz using the stock bearings. That is, if I add a 1/4 oz weight to > some > > random point on one of my (balanced) wheels using the method I > > described, the wheel will slowly rotate until that 1/4 oz weight > is at > > the bottom of the wheel. My stock bearings have been operating just > > fine at speed for 32,000 miles now. I check my bearings every time > I > > change tires to make sure they don't have too much play and that > there > > are no rough spots. It may be that the dry climate I live in (well, > > during half the year!), and the fact that my bearings have never > spent > > any time underwater, has something to do with their long life. > > > > > friction for accurate wheel balancing IMO. A dedicated wheel > > balancer with > > > minimally lubricated bearings is what the racers use. > > > > Yes, they also balance to within 1/16 oz. Given that my KLR will > never > > see 90mph (much less the 150mph that the racers reach!), I'm going > to > > spend my money on something else. Personally I think within 1/4 oz > is > > fine for a KLR. > > > > > Technically you only need to balance the wheel once and then > permanently > > > mark the heavy spot. > > > > Err, no. Tires have a heavy spot too, due to the mold design and > how > > rubber is injected into the mold. Typically there will be a yellow > > mark opposite the heavy spot which, if you match it up with your > > tube's air valve, will result in a tire-wheel combo that is much > > better matched than if you don't use the yellow mark. Also note > that > > since we have tube-type tires, our tubes change the balance also, > > especially if you are using an 18" tube in your rear tire. That > tube > > will have heavy spots where the rubber isn't stretched as far as in > > other spots. I've found that if I pop one side of my tire off, pull > > out the tube, and put the exact same tube back in and re- inflate, > my > > balance changes. (Yes, I did that, when testing how much work it'd > be > > to put a new tube in while in the field). > > > > > > > I enjoy changing wheels and balancing, so I start from > > > zero every time, wheel then wheel and tire (tire light spot at > wheel > > heavy > > > spot). > > > > That sounds like it would work better with tubeless tires than with > > tube-type tires. I find that lining up the light spot on the tire > with > > the heavy spot on the tube (the valve) tends to work best, I rarely > > have to put any weight at all on the front tire when I do this > because > > it is balanced to within 1/4 oz. > > > > > > > On 8/9/06, E.L. Green wrote: > > > > > > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com 40yahoogroups.com>, > > > > "rschulte46" wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Everyone talks a lot about tires and how they have changed > them > > > > > themselves under a myriad of circumstances. I don't think I > have > > seen > > > > > anyone talk about balancing the wheel. Why? > > > > > > > > > > > > > You haven't been looking hard. For example: > > > > > > > > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DSN_KLR650/message/156227 > > > > > > > > has a whole big discussion of wheel balancing. > > > > > > > > How to do it: Assuming the bike is hoisted off the ground on a > lift, > > > > take the front brake caliper off and hang it from the handbars > with a > > > > bungee to keep from stressing the brake fittings. Take the > speedo > > > > cable off, and take the wheel off and remove the speedo drive. > Put > > > > wheel back on its axle and spin it. Note where it comes to > rest. > > > > Repeat. If it comes to rest on the same spot a second time, > add a > > > > 1/4oz weight on the other side (temporarily duct tape it for > now). > > > > Spin again. If the side with the 1/4oz weight ends up on the > bottom, > > > > take weight off, you're done . Usually you'll find that, if > you > > > > aligned the dot that denotes the "light spot" on the tire with > the > > > > valve stem, you'll need at most 1/4 oz of weight to balance > it. I find > > > > that even if I clean the rim well with brake cleaner, stick- on > weights > > > > will eventually fly off with a sound like a gunshot unless I > top'em > > > > with duct tape. So you might want to try the spoke-type > weights if > > > > you're doing the front. I think you might need some better > bearings to > > > > get to within 1/8oz, but the stock bearings work fine for > getting to > > > > within 1/4oz. > > > > > > > > On the back, the process is similar, but you remove the > sprocket > > > > assembly as well as the rear brake caliper. The rear typically > will > > > > take much more weight to balance because the tire has a bigger > > > > cross-section and thus small changes in rubber density make a > big > > > > difference in weight. The practice of putting 18" tubes is > especially > > > > interesting, because it'll stretch differently every time, > requiring a > > > > different weight distribution even if you're putting the same > tire and > > > > tube back on. > > > > > > > > The most difficult balancing job I had was when I was prying > the tire > > > > onto the rim, and one of my tire irons flew out and flew > somewhere. I > > > > looked around and didn't see it, so I grabbed another iron and > > > > finished putting the tire on. Then I tried to balance it. > There was > > > > one side that was really, really heavy. Too heavy. Hmm. Did I > somehow > > > > manage to put the dot on the wrong side? So I popped one side > of the > > > > tire back off and started spinning it on the rim... and hear > something > > > > rattle. > > > > > > > > Yep, there was my missing tire iron! > > > > > > > > Lesson: It's really hard to balance a tire if you put a tire > iron > > > > inside the tire . > > > > > > > > -E > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > James Morrow Sr > > > Union, MO > > > '00' RT + dual plug + Bunkhouse > > > '00' BUSA + 15hp > > > '05' KLR650 + big fun factor > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > >

[E.L. Green]

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "blckjck" wrote:

> I have had very good success gravity balancing my tires. I use > the wheels and trucks that have been remove from a set of roller > blades. They have ABEC-7 bearings that offer very little rolling > resistance. I mount the trucks on saw horses (anything similar that > will provide clearance for the wheel will work). Make sure that the > blade wheels are on the same level plane. Using the axle from the > bike, support the wheel. Rotate the wheel, it will stop with the > heavey side down.

Indeed. I've used saw horses before for the same basic thing. What I found was that I didn't get any better results than with the wheel's own bearings. But then, as I've noted, I don't balance closer than 1/4oz. If I was going for 1/8th oz I'd probably need something like that.

> problems. I would caution using stick-on type weights, especialy if > running of road. They can be dislodged by terrian and bumps.

I've lost stick-on weights, they can even be dislodged by bumpy roads, nevermind offroad. On the other hand, I've never lost stick-on weights that were topped with duct tape. Looks really tacky, though!

> wear can change the balance of a tire as heavier spots are removed.

Good reminder. My current set of tires is a little over half gone, I'm going to re-balance them this weekend when I do some other maintenance on my bike. -E

[Don S]

I had a rear tire changed a few weeks ago at the dealer's. They advised me they couldn't balance the tire. I advised them that was just fine. I didn't want it balanced and I'm not paying the money they were about to charge for it. Apparently, the E-Z seal goop I had put in the tubes made it impossible for them to balance the tire. I have also read that if one uses E-Z seal or something similar, tire balancing would not likely be necessary. That, I am not sure of. I can say however, that I have not had any balance issues with the new unbalanced tire/wheel. I would suspect that most knob type tires designed for sub 100 mph speeds, would probably not respond dramatically to balancing. One would have to question the effects of balancing knob type tires once the tire has been subjected to wear. Would the wear/balance factor be linear? That is, as the tire wears, will the balance remain constant? Personally, I doubt it. Many may not agree but I think balancing KLR tires/wheels is really a luxury rather than a necessity. Don blckjck wrote: Please forgive the previous post... I replied to Mr. Green privatly, went back and sent, just to realize what I sent him wasn't there. Let's try this again... I have had very good success gravity balancing my tires. I use the wheels and trucks that have been remove from a set of roller blades. They have ABEC-7 bearings that offer very little rolling resistance. I mount the trucks on saw horses (anything similar that will provide clearance for the wheel will work). Make sure that the blade wheels are on the same level plane. Using the axle from the bike, support the wheel. Rotate the wheel, it will stop with the heavey side down. When my wheels have been out of balance, I notice it at just past 60MPH. I have taken my balanced wheels past 100MPH with no problems. I would caution using stick-on type weights, especialy if running of road. They can be dislodged by terrian and bumps. Also wear can change the balance of a tire as heavier spots are removed. My 2 cents...

--- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "blckjck" wrote: > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "E.L. Green" wrote: > > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com, "James Morrow Sr" > > wrote: > > > > > > This may work, but I would never trust it. A balancer needs > minimal > > > friction. If you don't have grease in your wheel bearings, they > > won't work > > > very long at speed. > > > > Well, all I can tell you is that I can balance my tires to within > 1/4 > > oz using the stock bearings. That is, if I add a 1/4 oz weight to > some > > random point on one of my (balanced) wheels using the method I > > described, the wheel will slowly rotate until that 1/4 oz weight > is at > > the bottom of the wheel. My stock bearings have been operating just > > fine at speed for 32,000 miles now. I check my bearings every time > I > > change tires to make sure they don't have too much play and that > there > > are no rough spots. It may be that the dry climate I live in (well, > > during half the year!), and the fact that my bearings have never > spent > > any time underwater, has something to do with their long life. > > > > > friction for accurate wheel balancing IMO. A dedicated wheel > > balancer with > > > minimally lubricated bearings is what the racers use. > > > > Yes, they also balance to within 1/16 oz. Given that my KLR will > never > > see 90mph (much less the 150mph that the racers reach!), I'm going > to > > spend my money on something else. Personally I think within 1/4 oz > is > > fine for a KLR. > > > > > Technically you only need to balance the wheel once and then > permanently > > > mark the heavy spot. > > > > Err, no. Tires have a heavy spot too, due to the mold design and > how > > rubber is injected into the mold. Typically there will be a yellow > > mark opposite the heavy spot which, if you match it up with your > > tube's air valve, will result in a tire-wheel combo that is much > > better matched than if you don't use the yellow mark. Also note > that > > since we have tube-type tires, our tubes change the balance also, > > especially if you are using an 18" tube in your rear tire. That > tube > > will have heavy spots where the rubber isn't stretched as far as in > > other spots. I've found that if I pop one side of my tire off, pull > > out the tube, and put the exact same tube back in and re- inflate, > my > > balance changes. (Yes, I did that, when testing how much work it'd > be > > to put a new tube in while in the field). > > > > > > > I enjoy changing wheels and balancing, so I start from > > > zero every time, wheel then wheel and tire (tire light spot at > wheel > > heavy > > > spot). > > > > That sounds like it would work better with tubeless tires than with > > tube-type tires. I find that lining up the light spot on the tire > with > > the heavy spot on the tube (the valve) tends to work best, I rarely > > have to put any weight at all on the front tire when I do this > because > > it is balanced to within 1/4 oz. > > > > > > > On 8/9/06, E.L. Green wrote: > > > > > > > > --- In DSN_KLR650@yahoogroups.com 40yahoogroups.com>, > > > > "rschulte46" wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Everyone talks a lot about tires and how they have changed > them > > > > > themselves under a myriad of circumstances. I don't think I > have > > seen > > > > > anyone talk about balancing the wheel. Why? > > > > > > > > > > > > > You haven't been looking hard. For example: > > > > > > > > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DSN_KLR650/message/156227 > > > > > > > > has a whole big discussion of wheel balancing. > > > > > > > > How to do it: Assuming the bike is hoisted off the ground on a > lift, > > > > take the front brake caliper off and hang it from the handbars > with a > > > > bungee to keep from stressing the brake fittings. Take the > speedo > > > > cable off, and take the wheel off and remove the speedo drive. > Put > > > > wheel back on its axle and spin it. Note where it comes to > rest. > > > > Repeat. If it comes to rest on the same spot a second time, > add a > > > > 1/4oz weight on the other side (temporarily duct tape it for > now). > > > > Spin again. If the side with the 1/4oz weight ends up on the > bottom, > > > > take weight off, you're done . Usually you'll find that, if > you > > > > aligned the dot that denotes the "light spot" on the tire with > the > > > > valve stem, you'll need at most 1/4 oz of weight to balance > it. I find > > > > that even if I clean the rim well with brake cleaner, stick- on > weights > > > > will eventually fly off with a sound like a gunshot unless I > top'em > > > > with duct tape. So you might want to try the spoke-type > weights if > > > > you're doing the front. I think you might need some better > bearings to > > > > get to within 1/8oz, but the stock bearings work fine for > getting to > > > > within 1/4oz. > > > > > > > > On the back, the process is similar, but you remove the > sprocket > > > > assembly as well as the rear brake caliper. The rear typically > will > > > > take much more weight to balance because the tire has a bigger > > > > cross-section and thus small changes in rubber density make a > big > > > > difference in weight. The practice of putting 18" tubes is > especially > > > > interesting, because it'll stretch differently every time, > requiring a > > > > different weight distribution even if you're putting the same > tire and > > > > tube back on. > > > > > > > > The most difficult balancing job I had was when I was prying > the tire > > > > onto the rim, and one of my tire irons flew out and flew > somewhere. I > > > > looked around and didn't see it, so I grabbed another iron and > > > > finished putting the tire on. Then I tried to balance it. > There was > > > > one side that was really, really heavy. Too heavy. Hmm. Did I > somehow > > > > manage to put the dot on the wrong side? So I popped one side > of the > > > > tire back off and started spinning it on the rim... and hear > something > > > > rattle. > > > > > > > > Yep, there was my missing tire iron! > > > > > > > > Lesson: It's really hard to balance a tire if you put a tire > iron > > > > inside the tire . > > > > > > > > -E > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > James Morrow Sr > > > Union, MO > > > '00' RT + dual plug + Bunkhouse > > > '00' BUSA + 15hp > > > '05' KLR650 + big fun factor > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > --------------------------------- Want to be your own boss? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Fredric]

You know, I've been thinking...... We use "balancing fluid" in larger tires. It works VERY well. I'm wondering if 1-2oz. in a bike tire might do it. It should, in theory. Balancing fluid is mostly ethyl-glycol - Anti-freeze. We use it to change spring rates in air springs, as balancing fluid, all kinds of stuff. It's an interesting thought. Hope this helps [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]